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The End of the Scientific Age

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CWT36
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cwt36 wrote:
Since Karl Marx repudiated atheism as needless, you can hardly conclude that atheism was the reason for his atrocities.
Spot: You are correct regarding Marx. I worded that poorly, my intent was to continue my reference to the atrocities of Stalin.
Robert Tulip wrote:Colin, perhaps you are not aware of how militant godless atheism was a central unifying ideological theme for Soviet tyranny. You may wish to read information on the persecution of Christians in the Soviet Union and the league of the militant godless.
Robert: Per the sources you are referencing:
"While religion was never outlawed in the Soviet Union and the Soviet Constitution actually guaranteed religious freedom to all Soviet citizens, persecution of Christians was still government policy. The persecutions were usually carried out for political rather than religious reasons and largely abated during World War II, at which time Stalin's government reached a truce with the Church in order to use it as part of its program to inspire Russian patriotic fervor." (emphasis mine)

"S.o.G.'s slogan was 'Struggle against religion is a struggle for socialism', which was meant to tie in their atheist views with economy, politics, and culture." (emphasis mine)

Stalin was a dogmatic proponent of communism who thought (at one point) that the policy of atheism was a means to that goal. He also murdered his political rivals and intellectuals many of whom were atheists themselves.

I have been rebutting Star's assertion that Stalin killed in the name of atheism. Your references reinforce the fact that at one point the abolition of religion was a policy of Stalin and the communist party. However, atheism was not his goal, it was not his guiding ideology, communism was.
-Colin

"Do not tell fish stories where the people know you; but particularly, don't tell them where they know the fish." -Mark Twain
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stahrwe

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Interbane wrote:Star: "sorry, but your analogy fails."

Want to talk about why rationalization is an invalid method of explaining biblical difficulties yet? If not, let me know when you're ready.

Any time you are ready.
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Colin,

I never said Stalin killed in the name of atheism, where did you get that?
Nor did I say that no one ever killed/murdered in the name of Christianity. The point I was getting at was that atheists have been responsible for more misery, death and destruction than Christians.
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stahrwe

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CWT36 wrote:
cwt36 wrote:
I have been rebutting Star's assertion that Stalin killed in the name of atheism. Your references reinforce the fact that at one point the abolition of religion was a policy of Stalin and the communist party. However, atheism was not his goal, it was not his guiding ideology, communism was.
So communism was the reason Stalin killed all of those peopel? Please clarify.
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CWT36
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stahrwe wrote: So communism was the reason Stalin killed all of those peopel? Please clarify.
As I said earlier, I don't care to foster a new debate with you, so I will retract my statements regarding Stalin.

I don't want to divert you from your responses regarding ostriches, dinosaurs, and an ark.
-Colin

"Do not tell fish stories where the people know you; but particularly, don't tell them where they know the fish." -Mark Twain
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stahrwe

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Colin,

Nice, can't you be gracious without an attempt to subvert the discussion.

So far I have demonstrated:

Atheism is being rejected by atheisitic countries in favor of Christianity. Perhaps Mr. Hitchens should consider that before he makes an even bigger fool of himself.

The issue about bats being misclassified as birds has been resolved in the Bible's favor.

Dinosaurs were not giant humans as some atheists think.

Dinosaurs are mentioned in the Bible.

You persist in the ostrich issue despite a resonable explanation disposing of it.

WHat is your issue about the Ark? Someone posted a question regarding how the whales and fish survived the flood. Is that your question?
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Star: "Atheism is being rejected by atheisitic countries in favor of Christianity."

:laugh: What precisely is being rejected? A lack of opium? Norway proves you wrong.

Star: "The issue about bats being misclassified as birds has been resolved in the Bible's favor."

Not resolved, rationalized. Therefore invalid.

Star: "Dinosaurs are mentioned in the Bible."

They are not. You interpret a passage to mean dinosaurs. This is a rationalization and is invalid.

Star: "You persist in the ostrich issue despite a resonable explanation disposing of it."

Reasonable explanation = rationalization, therefore invalid.

With your pompous derision of others not taking the time to do research, I challenge you to research why your rationalizations are invalid. It's an epistemic matter.

You still haven't explained how dinosaur bones were places in the ground that are millions of years old, and how light from distant stars is already reaching us even though those stars are millions of light years away. Perhaps one day I'll persist in a delusion as all encompassing as yours. It must be blissful, your ignorance.
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The issue about bats being misclassified as birds has been resolved in the Bible's favor.
no it certainly has not. Lets review. You say that the bible can say bats are birds because fowl may have meant flying animals. That does not work because of the inclusion of the ostrich, which indicates they were in fact refering to birds, and not flying animals. On top of that, if it were flying creatures then where are the references to poisonous insects that people should avoid eating?

If in fact it was meant to be flying creatures then the bible contains an error, as it includes the ostrich. If it is birds, then the bible contains an error because it includes the bat.

You seriously think you won this one? That is completely rediculous.
This is a level of denial i have only ever seen in a fictional character star.
Dinosaurs were not giant humans as some atheists think.
You are mis-representing Frank's quote in a silly attempt to foist the source of this rediculous claim on atheists when frank was clearly sighting a conversation he had with other religious people and their failed attempt to rationalize dinosaur's existence and their mention in the bible.
Dinosaurs are mentioned in the Bible.
You have not provided any evidence of this. On the other hand we have procided several examples that might be construed as a description of a dinosaur, but were in fact references to well established mythical creatures, such as the Behemoth and Ziz.
You persist in the ostrich issue despite a resonable explanation disposing of it.
The reasonable explaination you posted was nicely countered by Frank's research into the topic. Besides which, the bible says "ostrich". If that is wrong, then guess what... that's an error.

That is one giant FAIL for you star.
At least make a credible effort to refute our arguments before proclaiming victory.
Last edited by johnson1010 on Wed Sep 16, 2009 3:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
In the absence of God, I found Man.
-Guillermo Del Torro

Are you pushing your own short comings on us and safely hating them from a distance?

Is this the virtue of faith? To never change your mind: especially when you should?

Young Earth Creationists take offense at the idea that we have a common heritage with other animals. Why is being the descendant of a mud golem any better?
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CWT36
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stahrwe wrote: WHat is your issue about the Ark? Someone posted a question regarding how the whales and fish survived the flood. Is that your question?
To paraphrase you: I've already given you the questions three times, you can do the research to find them. :razz2:
stahrwe wrote:Colin,

Nice, can't you be gracious without an attempt to subvert the discussion.
Sorry for the misunderstanding, I wasn't attempting to be gracious. :P
-Colin

"Do not tell fish stories where the people know you; but particularly, don't tell them where they know the fish." -Mark Twain
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