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U.S. GOP Candidate Mike Huckabee - Disturbing video

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Is Jesus helping Mike Huckabee win the Republican nomination for President?

Poll ended at Sat Dec 29, 2007 7:02 pm

Yes. All Republican nominees are selected by God and all Democrats are selected by Satan.
0

No votes
No, this is naked superstition if not insanity.
2

20%
No, the Flying Spaghetti Monster determines U.S. elections.
3

30%
Yes, but ultimately the Invisible Pink Unicorn controls all.
1

10%
A Celestial Teapot orbiting the Sun between Earth and Mars exerts a gentle but malevolent influence on all terrestrial democratic elections.
1

10%
Yes and the world DEMANDS another Crusader in the White House!
0

No votes
Pardon me while I puke - I'm too nauseous to vote on this (even though I just did).
2

20%
Sheesh, get over it, at least he ain't Hillary!
0

No votes
42 - The Ultimate Answer.
1

10%
 
Total votes: 10
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Mr. P

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MadArchitect wrote:
And no, of course, it doesn't have to be you who offers the olive branch, but why shouldn't it be? You should scramble for the opportunity to show that you're concerned enough about the state of discourse on BookTalk to overlook an incident like this. After all, this was really quite small, in the scale of thing. And yet, somehow, it's gotten more responses than any other thread currently active on the board.

And that's really my last word on the subject. If anyone wants to continue to talk about Huckabee or the primaries in general, I'll be glad for the change of subject.
I have no reason to offer an olive branch. I am not the one carrying on. If Rose even made ANY attempt to rectify the situation, I would have followed suit. Why dont you address a post to her too Mad? Hmm? How about that?

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Rose, be a love. Kiss and make up.

There. Happy?
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MadArchitect wrote:Rose, be a love. Kiss and make up.
No problem. I had tried to do as much on Monday, at the very beginning of this, when I wrote:

"Perhaps I shouldn't have addressed the clarification to you, personally."

And then reiterated the concession again on Tuesday. I also twice asked Mr. P., what else he wanted me to say, outside of conceding the validity of the clarification, that would give him satisfaction. I'm not sure if, once again, conceding that perhaps I shouldn't have directed the clarification to him will end this, but I'll give it another shot.

Again, Mr. P., hope this spat doesn't interfere with any of our other discussions on this forum.

So, hugs and kisses and all that....? Image

(No I don't wear blue ribbons in my hair. But I used to.)
MadArchitect

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Hey, Mr P., you were right: That was much easier than trying to get you to end it!
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Mr. P

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MadArchitect wrote:Hey, Mr P., you were right: That was much easier than trying to get you to end it!
Listen Mad, why dont you take your own advice and learn when to drop things. I know you want to do damage control and make Rose look like the rational one here...but you know as well as I, that I was the one who handled themselves more responsibly on the forums in this particular case.


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LanDroid

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MadArchitect wrote:Thirty second soundbytes probably aren't going to help in a case like this. What's needed is some level of discourse that addresses the question of why a democratic republic is best served by not confusing religious standards with constitutional law. And to do that, you're going to have to establish a level of discourse that is both inviting to the populous but sophisticated enough to present complex ideas without sacrificing on their consistency and persuasive power.
I agree that would be nice. I saw the rules to the Lincoln/Douglas debates recently. One candidate would speak for an hour, then the other for 1.5 hours, then the first again for 1/2 hour. The next debate the order was reversed. There were seven of these debates. And this was just for a Senate seat in Illinois!

Imagine if we tried something like that for the final two candidates in this Presidential race. Between our TV/internet addled attention spans and partisans interested only in watching their own candidate speak, about 2500 Americans might watch one such debate and about 25 would watch the rest.

You may remember Bill Clinton gave the keynote address at a Democratic convention and spoke for something like 40 - 50 minutes. His final paragraph began with "So in closing..." which drove the crowd to cheers. Clinton heard complaints about the length of that speech for years afterwards.

So although I agree with you, in today's world 30 second TV ads pairing Huckabee's comment about Jesus backing his campaign with his desire to change the constitution in accordance with God's law would be very powerful.

Which brings up an interesting point - if this is a Christian nation and if American law is based on Judeo-Christian principles, why has the constitution needed to be revised at all? Hmmm.......
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LanDroid wrote:I saw the rules to the Lincoln/Douglas debates recently. Imagine if we tried something like that for the final two candidates in this Presidential race.
I think you're probably right that it wouldn't work in the current atmosphere, but I have reservations about your rationale for why. I can't help but think that our attention spans are so short with politicians in part because we have the perception that so little of what they say is trustworthy. Maybe we can only stomach the politicians in 90 second intervals because that's as long as it takes us to assess whether or not what they're saying is worth listening to.

At any rate, I'm skeptical of the received wisdom that says the public is attention span deficient, and therefore the campaign system is dangerously limited. Hardly anyone seems to have given much thought to the possibility that it's the other way around. In general, I would say that lack of attention span is indicative of a cultural adaptation to an environment where in depth attention rewards us less and less.

But on the whole, the question of what it would take to make the U.S. election process more conformable to the ideal it's supposed to represent is a compelling one to me, and I wouldn't mind seeing it turned into its own thread, if anyone else is interested.
Which brings up an interesting point - if this is a Christian nation and if American law is based on Judeo-Christian principles, why has the constitution needed to be revised at all? Hmmm.......
Probably because it's also based on Enlightenment political theory. I don't know how many evangelical critics would be willing to really talk about, or even admit, the fact of admixture, but historical inquiry would tend to make that clear enough.
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We may have a chance to increase the limits of our attention span this election cycle. I've seen several complaints by talking heads that it's not possible to say anything substantive on important issues in 90 seconds. I think we agree the Lincoln/Douglas debates were too extreme for modern America, but perhaps candidates will be given more time. In past presidential debates, they've had around 5 minutes per side at a time as I recall. That sounds better than 90 seconds, but remember most of the time they start a response by answering a previous point from an opponent, so the direct response to the question is still very limited. Perhaps 20 minutes per side on a major topic would be more substantive?

"In general, I would say that lack of attention span is indicative of a cultural adaptation to an environment where in depth attention rewards us less and less. "

Isn't that just another way of saying our attention span has been addled by TV/Internet? :D
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LanDroid wrote:I think we agree the Lincoln/Douglas debates were too extreme for modern America, but perhaps candidates will be given more time.

I don't. If a politician can speak substantively for 90 minutes, I say let them. The problem is that most politicians seem horrified by the prospect of actually talking about an issue for an hour. Typically, they'll only say what they know will win them points or what they'll lose points for not saying. If they can avoid answering a question that might hurt them, they will. And if they're arguing for a longer time limit in upcoming debates, I suspect it's because they don't want the other guy getting the last point on the previous question. The strategy appears to be, get in as much of a rebuttal as you can, then say the absolute minimum required by the question so that the next guy has virtually nothing to criticize in what you've said.
Isn't that just another way of saying our attention span has been addled by TV/Internet?
No, it's a way of saying that our attentions spans have been addled by people and institutions that have learned that it's easier to side step resistance by not saying anything worth hearing. Television shows are getting longer, and more of them seem to be presenting plots that require an ongoing commitment in terms of attention. It's the rest of society that's falling behind.
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Alrighty then, I say we return to the Lincoln/Douglas format this election cycle. Seven debates, 3 hours of uninterrupted speeches each plus breaks. Should be easy to sell that concept...
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