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The Debt We Owe to Christian Mathematicians and Logicians https://www.booktalk.org/thedebtweowetochristianmathematiciansandlogicianst14293.html 
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Author:  stahrwe [ Thu Mar 14, 2013 7:44 am ] 
Post subject:  The Debt We Owe to Christian Mathematicians and Logicians 
There is a prejudice rampant among certain groups that the Bible not only does not encourage the application of logic, but, actually discourages it. I will leave the enumeration of applicable Bible verses for a different discussion, and instead use this one to introduce the Christians who advanced logic and mathematics, or made significant discoveries. I chose this forum as the closest, relevant one. Though the description does note including mathematics or logic, they fit the subject. 
Author:  stahrwe [ Thu Mar 14, 2013 8:07 am ]  
Post subject:  Re: The Debt We Owe to Christian Mathematicians and Logicians  
Another "Sandman" connection. Recall that Cesterton was a character at Fiddlers Green. Quote is from Wikipedia. I did this my Kindle so could no copy url from Wikipedia.I will post it later. 
Author:  geo [ Thu Mar 14, 2013 8:14 am ] 
Post subject:  Re: The Debt We Owe to Christian Mathematicians and Logicians 
Christian mathematicians? The development of math and logic occurred independently of religion. Not sure what you're saying here. 
Author:  Dexter [ Thu Mar 14, 2013 9:29 am ] 
Post subject:  Re: The Debt We Owe to Christian Mathematicians and Logicians 
We should also have a thread for alcoholic mathematicians, so we can properly acknowledge the contribution of booze to society. 
Author:  stahrwe [ Thu Mar 14, 2013 9:49 am ] 
Post subject:  Re: The Debt We Owe to Christian Mathematicians and Logicians 
I would suggest that if BookTalk.org had previously had a discussion claiming that said impaired persons had not contributed to science, logic, statistics, or mathematics. I am not aware of any such discussion. However, I am aware of posts claiming that the Bible does not advocate for logic, and posts claiming that Christians are ignorant and unscientific. The history of contributions to mathematics, statistics, logic and science clearly contradict such claims. The previous post does not pertain to the subject matter of the initial point regarding Raymond Lull. Instead, it promotes a prejudice against the premise of this discussion. In other posts I have suggested that such inaccurate claims are hurtful; not to Christianity, but to the credibility of the claim. It really is too bad that these people are not only not appreciated, or known, but when they are mentioned they are dismissed. It never hurts to learn something, and even if their world view is not one you share, that does not mean that their contribution must be dismissed. 
Author:  johnson1010 [ Thu Mar 14, 2013 10:44 am ] 
Post subject:  Re: The Debt We Owe to Christian Mathematicians and Logicians 
It is the study of mathematics which lead to advances in mathematics. Algebra is not islamic, though developed in muslim countries. The compass is not the product of chinese ancestor worship though developed in the Han Dynasty. there is no such thing as christian physics, only christians who were physicists. To the extent any advancement is made in science it is to do with the work put forward in that discipline to produce results. 
Author:  Dexter [ Thu Mar 14, 2013 10:51 am ]  
Post subject:  Re: The Debt We Owe to Christian Mathematicians and Logicians  
I doubt anyone claimed that Christians cannot contribute to science. But they are doing science, not theology. If Christians take the Bible literally, then regarding those claims they are ignorant and unscientific. But you can believe those things and still do math, just like you can believe in Santa Claus and still do math. 
Author:  stahrwe [ Thu Mar 14, 2013 11:32 am ] 
Post subject:  Re: The Debt We Owe to Christian Mathematicians and Logicians 
When I joined BookTalk.org I was confidently told by several regulars that there was no way that I owned a copy of The Handbook of Chemistry and Physics and that there was no way that I could prove that E=MC^2 was derived from F=Ma*. The point is not where algebra originated, or anything else related to either of your posts. The point is that there is a small group of materialists who persist in representing Christians as unintelligent. I can prove that. Stephen Hawking did it in the Curiosity episode on the origin of the universe when he misrepresented Pope John XXI as ignorant and antiscience. I have attached a brief bio of John XXI from an atheist website. Pope John XXI That derivation was posted in another discussion. 
Author:  sonoman [ Thu Mar 14, 2013 6:04 pm ] 
Post subject:  Re: The Debt We Owe to Christian Mathematicians and Logicians 
Starhwe, expect no rational responses here from atheists members, monitors, owner. They are locked into their atheist bigotry against theists, especially Christian ones and you could post the formula for the God Particle and get nothing but slander of your references and yourselfbecause atheists are not tuned to critical thinking but to red flags that identify a poster as a theist and therefore a target for ad hominen attack. This happens because atheism itself is a fundamentalist belief system that can only be held by ignoring any facts that counter the basic ideology. I speak from experience here trying to get atheists to think logically but it doesn't work with them anymore than it works with fundamentalist Christians or Muslims. 
Author:  Dexter [ Thu Mar 14, 2013 6:25 pm ]  
Post subject:  Re: The Debt We Owe to Christian Mathematicians and Logicians  
Too bad atheism is neither fundamentalist nor a belief system nor an ideology. Other than that, you've got a real handle on the definition. 
Author:  stahrwe [ Thu Mar 14, 2013 6:50 pm ] 
Post subject:  Re: The Debt We Owe to Christian Mathematicians and Logicians 
In fact atheism is a belief system. As Chesterton said, "If there were no God there would be no atheists." 
Author:  Chris OConnor [ Thu Mar 14, 2013 7:21 pm ] 
Post subject:  Re: The Debt We Owe to Christian Mathematicians and Logicians 
Atheism most certainly is not a belief system. Is bald a hair color? Atheism is simply the lack of belief. All you know about an atheist is that they lack the belief in a God or gods. You don't know anything about their actual beliefs. You don't know that they believe a God doesn't exist. They just lack the belief. Everyone on this planet was born without beliefs including the God belief. In other words we were all born as atheists and remained as atheists until we were introduced to the God concept. I'm an atheist. That tells you what I do NOT believe in. But what DO I believe in? I'm a secular humanist. My beliefs can be studied and understood by learning about the principles of secular humanism. You can't glean anything about my beliefs by pointing at something I don't believe in. I also don't believe in unicorns. Does my lack of belief in unicorns tell you about my beliefs? Of course not. 
Author:  youkrst [ Thu Mar 14, 2013 8:11 pm ]  
Post subject:  Re: The Debt We Owe to Christian Mathematicians and Logicians  
then
pot>kettle>black? touche! en guarde.. chill out sonoman it's only a movie don't get too into your role c'mon get paxcalibur out and we'll dance with the devil in the pale moonlight 
Author:  DWill [ Thu Mar 14, 2013 8:31 pm ] 
Post subject:  Re: The Debt We Owe to Christian Mathematicians and Logicians 
The point he was making, I thought, was that being, not just a Christian, but a Christian functionary such as a priest or monk didn't prevent some from advancing mathematics, science, and other fields. And obviously that's true. Mendel was a monk, e.g. Surprisingly, Christopher Hitchens acknowledges this in GiNG. It's really odd: sometimes we can see religion (pick any of the big three) acting to retard this kind of progress, other times not impeding it or even fostering it. Islam once wasn't hostile to science and the liberal arts, but that was centuries ago. Christianity has seemed to do quite a lot better. There are the "Dark Ages" to confront, but we'd need to consult a bunch of good historians before we blame that on Christianity. 
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