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The House of the Spirits; Rosa the Beautiful 
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Post Re: The House of the Spirits; Rosa the Beautiful
Aqueda_Veronica wrote:
When it comes to Rosa's and Esteban's relationship - it did feel a bit off. It's not that she didn't love him, she was simply immersed in her own world. And he was allured by her beauty and the aura of mysticism surrounding her. I found it endearing that the guy was willing to sacrifice for Rosa and work hard to accommodate enough wealth to set up a life together at a decent level. The numerous letters he wrote are a proof it was not just pure lust.


I was thinking that Esteban was more inclined to be in love with the notion of being in love. A big crush that went too far.



Sat Nov 19, 2011 8:31 am
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Post Re: The House of the Spirits; Rosa the Beautiful
I still have some posts on page 2 to read but I need to take my dog out for his morning hoof.

I am enjoying the book and now realize that I will get more out of it by reading it with a group. I never would of connected Barrabas like you guys. I just thought of him as some big Irish Wolfhound. Some symbolism goes over my head. Okay most of it goes over my head.

Too bad Uncle Marco had to die. I thought he was a fun character and would love to read his life story.



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Sat Nov 19, 2011 8:45 am
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Post Re: The House of the Spirits; Rosa the Beautiful
I know this question is off topic but could someone please direct me to a thread here at Book Talk on how to post pictures. I have done a search and nothing is jumping out at me.

Thanks



Sat Nov 19, 2011 10:21 am
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Post Re: The House of the Spirits; Rosa the Beautiful
Damifino wrote:
how to post pictures

Look at the cryptically titled BBCode Explained - faq.php?mode=bbcode
It explains how to use the [img] wraparound for jpg and similar files


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Last edited by Robert Tulip on Sun Nov 20, 2011 6:14 am, edited 1 time in total.



Sat Nov 19, 2011 1:23 pm
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Post Re: The House of the Spirits; Rosa the Beautiful
I’m still thinking about the link between Barrabas and Uncle Marcos. Barrabas the biblical thief lived while Jesus died. The dog Barrabas arrives caged, and is set free, while Uncle Marcos has died. Do you think that together with his ‘magical books’ (the scriptures?) we are to see him as a Jesus figure.
I also thought the scene where the crowds arrive to view his forthcoming aerial journey very reminiscent of Jesus’ entry into Jerusalem. ‘groups of elementary-school children paraded with their teachers, clutching flowers for the hero’. Then of course, Uncle Marcos ‘ascends’ in his bird and dies only to be reborn again. ‘Marcos’s heroic resurrection made everyone forget about his barrel-organ phase’.


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Sun Nov 20, 2011 5:52 am
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Post Re: The House of the Spirits; Rosa the Beautiful
Damifino - I'm sure you asked somewhere what time the book is set in. (Can't find the post now) I've been puzzling over this too. The family own a Ford? Sunbeam. Production started in about 1925, and the family had it for ten years. So I would think the events happen between 1915 -20 at the beginning. Esteban lives to be 90 just after the time of the coup, which was in 1973, and was 25 at the start of the narrative, so he was born about 1890. Maths not my best subject!


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Sun Nov 20, 2011 6:01 am
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Post Re: The House of the Spirits; Rosa the Beautiful
heledd wrote:
I’m still thinking about the link between Barrabas and Uncle Marcos. Barrabas the biblical thief lived while Jesus died. The dog Barrabas arrives caged, and is set free, while Uncle Marcos has died. Do you think that together with his ‘magical books’ (the scriptures?) we are to see him as a Jesus figure.
I also thought the scene where the crowds arrive to view his forthcoming aerial journey very reminiscent of Jesus’ entry into Jerusalem. ‘groups of elementary-school children paraded with their teachers, clutching flowers for the hero’. Then of course, Uncle Marcos ‘ascends’ in his bird and dies only to be reborn again. ‘Marcos’s heroic resurrection made everyone forget about his barrel-organ phase’.


This makes a lot of sense. Marcos's harebrained mechanical bird is reminiscent of the ascension of Jesus Christ into heaven. His magical books are the main inspiration for Clara, as we will read later, providing the heart and soul of the house of the spirits. The travels of Marcos to Tibet etc suggest the apocryphal stories of the journeys of Christ to the east.

I will have to look it up, but I was confused about how Barrabas arrives at the very start without mention of Marcos, and then we later learn that he belonged to Marcos.


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Sun Nov 20, 2011 6:13 am
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Post Re: The House of the Spirits; Rosa the Beautiful
Robert Tulip wrote:
Damifino wrote:
how to post pictures

Look at the cryptically titled BBCode Explained - faq.php?mode=bbcode
It explains how to use the [img] wraparound for jpg and similar files


Thanks. Too bad it wasn't in English. Think there is some hidden meaning in there just like The House of the Spirits. :shock: Kidding.



Sun Nov 20, 2011 9:22 am
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Post Re: The House of the Spirits; Rosa the Beautiful
Robert Tulip wrote:

I will have to look it up, but I was confused about how Barrabas arrives at the very start without mention of Marcos, and then we later learn that he belonged to Marcos.


Didn't Marcos get sick from some African plague (I'm thinking yellow fever) and died on a ship? The captain of the ship, Longfellow had wanted to throw him overboard but because Uncle Marcos made some friends on the ship he wasn't allowed. Longfellow had to send the coffin and all of Marcos's paraphernalia to his sister's house. Barrabas was included.

Oh darn....that wasn't your question.



Sun Nov 20, 2011 9:34 am
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Post Re: The House of the Spirits; Rosa the Beautiful
Clara finds Barrabas who's cage has been abandoned in the commotion of the uncle's body being brought back, so at first she is unaware of his death. What amazes me about the writing is how much information Allende manages to give about the characters, while at the same time talking about the church service.


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Sun Nov 20, 2011 11:30 am
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Post Re: The House of the Spirits; Rosa the Beautiful
Damifino wrote:
I was thinking that Esteban was more inclined to be in love with the notion of being in love. A big crush that went too far.


I agree with this. For me, Esteban is not in love with Rosa, he does not get the butterflies or the desire to share with her on a spiritual level.

Rosa is a mean to achieve respectability, to rise in the society, to discover something else than what he had with his mother and his sister.

She is pure, she seems unattainable and I think he believes marrying her will make him a "man".


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Quote of the month: She was already in the habit of writing down important matters, and afterward, when she was mute, she also recorded trivialities, never suspecting that fifty years later I would use her notebooks to reclaim the past and overcome terrors of my own. (House of Spirits, Isabel Allende)


Sun Nov 20, 2011 1:13 pm
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Post Re: The House of the Spirits; Rosa the Beautiful
Commutinggirl wrote:
Damifino wrote:
I was thinking that Esteban was more inclined to be in love with the notion of being in love. A big crush that went too far.

I agree with this. For me, Esteban is not in love with Rosa, he does not get the butterflies or the desire to share with her on a spiritual level. Rosa is a mean to achieve respectability, to rise in the society, to discover something else than what he had with his mother and his sister. She is pure, she seems unattainable and I think he believes marrying her will make him a "man".


And yet, it is love at first sight. Esteban is smitten before he even knows who Rosa is. If he was just cynically marrying for money and social position, he would probably have met a girl through social networks. I agree an element of cynicism comes into his calculation, but Esteban resolves never to marry after Rosa dies, because Rosa is his only love. When he later marries Rosa's sister Clara as a sort of proxy, the omen of the death of Barrabas at the engagement party tells him very clearly that this relationship is not a simple path to social acceptance. If that was his only motive, he could probably find a compliant girl who lacked any identity of her own.

The parable here is that conservatives fall in love with their dream of the mother land. They do not allow facts to get in the way of the beautiful story they weave in their heads. But they find that the object of their love does have an identity of its own,


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Post Re: The House of the Spirits; Rosa the Beautiful
Oh and has anyone noticed the very long sentences she very successfully uses? The words tumble and flow, and I wonder how on earth she keeps it all together. One of my favourites is in her description of Uncle Marcos:
‘After a short time, bored with having to appear at ladies’ gatherings where the mistress of the house played the piano, with playing cards, and with dodging all his relatives’ pressures to pull himself together and take a job as a clerk in Severo del Valle’s law practice, he bought a barrel organ and took to the streets with the hope of seducing his Cousin Antonieta and entertaining the public into the bargain’


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Thu Nov 24, 2011 6:07 am
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Post Re: The House of the Spirits; Rosa the Beautiful
heledd wrote:
Oh and has anyone noticed the very long sentences she very successfully uses? The words tumble and flow, and I wonder how on earth she keeps it all together.


That and the long paragraphs. I have seen some that are over a page long. Hard on the eyes. :?



Thu Nov 24, 2011 8:25 am
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Post Re: The House of the Spirits; Rosa the Beautiful
Somebody said it put them in mind of A 100 Years of Solitude ... well, I dunno why but I didn't see anything in that - same with Don Quixote ... I don't know what anybody sees in that story. Even the windmills thing ... just didn't do anything for me.

Anyway, from what I'm seeing here, looks like this one is a good story. I'm not going to compare it with anything else. There was no audio version available through the library, my net library or anywhere else. So I've got it here in actual 'text' form. I'm so spoiled with audio now.



Thu Nov 24, 2011 3:41 pm
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