Online reading group and book discussion forum
  HOME ENTER FORUMS OUR BOOKS LINKS DONATE ADVERTISE CONTACT  
View unanswered posts | View active topics It is currently Tue Aug 14, 2018 3:38 am





Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 14 posts ] • Topic evaluate: Evaluations: 1, 5.00 on the average.Evaluations: 1, 5.00 on the average.Evaluations: 1, 5.00 on the average.Evaluations: 1, 5.00 on the average.Evaluations: 1, 5.00 on the average. 
The A.S.P. Alphabet Soup Puzzle 
Author Message
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
pets endangered by possible book avalanche

Diamond Contributor

Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 4898
Location: Florida
Thanks: 177
Thanked: 344 times in 294 posts
Gender: Male
Country: United States (us)

Post The A.S.P. Alphabet Soup Puzzle
I have attached the ASP as a pdf file. I made one mistake in the file. The first letter should be lower case. There are only 3 capital letters. The collection instructions are within the puzzle. The prize is$100,000 after taxes.


Attachments:
asp.pdf [76.48 KiB]
Downloaded 71 times


_________________
n=Infinity
Sum n = -1/12
n=1

where n are natural numbers.
Tue Mar 25, 2014 7:24 am
Profile Email
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
BookTalk.org Hall of Fame

BookTalk.org Moderator
Gold Contributor

Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 6974
Location: Da U.P.
Thanks: 1041
Thanked: 2010 times in 1616 posts
Gender: Male
Country: United States (us)

Post Re: The A.S.P. Alphabet Soup Puzzle
It doesn't seem to be a straight modular cipher. If you check the frequency counts, each letter pops up within 5% of every other letter, between 1900 and 2k times each. If you check double letter frequency, it's even worse. Every letter has between 50 and 100 doubles.

It's too clean, there are either fillers or it gets translated to number then back to letter. If it's fillers, then there's a hopping algorithm. Skip every 2/3/4/5 letters, diagonal, vertical, backwards, mixed with a modular cipher.

Maybe playfair cipher or vigenere cipher?

The things I know how to try are likely too simple. What's the source of the puzzle?


_________________
In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and has been widely regarded as a bad move.” - Douglas Adams


Tue Mar 25, 2014 2:50 pm
Profile
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
pets endangered by possible book avalanche

Diamond Contributor

Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 4898
Location: Florida
Thanks: 177
Thanked: 344 times in 294 posts
Gender: Male
Country: United States (us)

Post Re: The A.S.P. Alphabet Soup Puzzle
I think it may be an image in some analog form. A decade or so there was a fad where you stared at a poster and eventually could see something, well some people could but I never was able to.

I have some summary data along the lines of most frequently occurring letter and pair. I will try to post this tonight.


_________________
n=Infinity
Sum n = -1/12
n=1

where n are natural numbers.


Tue Mar 25, 2014 4:48 pm
Profile Email
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
Bookasaurus

BookTalk.org Moderator
Silver Contributor

Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 1903
Location: Cincinnati, OH
Thanks: 62
Thanked: 675 times in 520 posts
Gender: Male
Country: United States (us)

Post Re: The A.S.P. Alphabet Soup Puzzle
It's gonna be solved by an employee of the N.S.A. :hmm:



Tue Mar 25, 2014 5:23 pm
Profile
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
BookTalk.org Hall of Fame

BookTalk.org Moderator
Gold Contributor

Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 6974
Location: Da U.P.
Thanks: 1041
Thanked: 2010 times in 1616 posts
Gender: Male
Country: United States (us)

Post Re: The A.S.P. Alphabet Soup Puzzle
Quote:
I have some summary data along the lines of most frequently occurring letter and pair. I will try to post this tonight.


I thought of copy/pasting it, but didn't see any significance. They're all more or less even.

Quote:
A decade or so there was a fad where you stared at a poster and eventually could see something, well some people could but I never was able to.


I still have a book of those. Cross your eyes then space out a little bit, and they'll eventually lock onto the right depth. It's like when you look at a door screen and it looks closer than it really is because your eyes are slightly crossed. Your brain thinks your eyes are looking at the right square, when in fact they're different squares.

If that's the case you could use geometry to transpose the letters. The math is beyond my experience. If you mean actual visual image, there is barely enough detail for a single word in aggregate. And if there are words, the frequency counts would be closer. I think it's one of the ciphers I mentioned, or some other advanced one that fills in gaps with underused letters.


_________________
In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and has been widely regarded as a bad move.” - Douglas Adams


Tue Mar 25, 2014 9:15 pm
Profile
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
pets endangered by possible book avalanche

Diamond Contributor

Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 4898
Location: Florida
Thanks: 177
Thanked: 344 times in 294 posts
Gender: Male
Country: United States (us)

Post Re: The A.S.P. Alphabet Soup Puzzle
The puzzle was created by a friend of mine with a PhD in computer programming. I do not know the solution but it should be solvable by a high school senior. The only other hint I got from him was a story about a substitute teacher who showed stereo pictures to a high school class using a tabletop viewer one looks down through.

The puzzle format should be on a broadside included in a newspaper. I could not find a paper size large enough to fit it all on one page.


_________________
n=Infinity
Sum n = -1/12
n=1

where n are natural numbers.


Wed Mar 26, 2014 5:52 am
Profile Email
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
BookTalk.org Hall of Fame

BookTalk.org Owner
Diamond Contributor 3

Joined: May 2002
Posts: 15855
Location: Florida
Thanks: 3324
Thanked: 1239 times in 981 posts
Gender: Male
Country: United States (us)
Highscores: 6

Post Re: The A.S.P. Alphabet Soup Puzzle
I wouldn't know where to start with a puzzle like this but I'll be watching to see what people come up with.



Wed Mar 26, 2014 8:49 am
Profile Email WWW
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
pets endangered by possible book avalanche

Diamond Contributor

Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 4898
Location: Florida
Thanks: 177
Thanked: 344 times in 294 posts
Gender: Male
Country: United States (us)

Post Re: The A.S.P. Alphabet Soup Puzzle
Here is some information I developed about the puzzle.

Attachment:
aspstats.pdf [13.17 KiB]
Downloaded 51 times


_________________
n=Infinity
Sum n = -1/12
n=1

where n are natural numbers.


Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:28 am
Profile Email
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
pets endangered by possible book avalanche

Diamond Contributor

Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 4898
Location: Florida
Thanks: 177
Thanked: 344 times in 294 posts
Gender: Male
Country: United States (us)

Post Re: The A.S.P. Alphabet Soup Puzzle
Here is some information given to me including a hint of some kind.

Attachment:
aspstatsbasic.pdf [197.74 KiB]
Downloaded 51 times


_________________
n=Infinity
Sum n = -1/12
n=1

where n are natural numbers.


Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:31 am
Profile Email
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
pets endangered by possible book avalanche

Diamond Contributor

Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 4898
Location: Florida
Thanks: 177
Thanked: 344 times in 294 posts
Gender: Male
Country: United States (us)

Post Re: The A.S.P. Alphabet Soup Puzzle
I think part of it may be a map because the last line is only five letters which spell miles.


_________________
n=Infinity
Sum n = -1/12
n=1

where n are natural numbers.


Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:32 am
Profile Email
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
BookTalk.org Hall of Fame

BookTalk.org Moderator
Gold Contributor

Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 6974
Location: Da U.P.
Thanks: 1041
Thanked: 2010 times in 1616 posts
Gender: Male
Country: United States (us)

Post Re: The A.S.P. Alphabet Soup Puzzle
What you said makes more sense now. There are full words in the mix, but with transposition according to some algorithm. The algorithm is probably similar to the one they used to make the 'secret pictures'. I'll take a look with fresh eyes later.

This morning I had to travel from one branch to another, and needed to carry some credit card information with me. So I wrote it on a sticky note in a cipher. My fascination with ciphers actually only started two weeks ago, when I started Cryptonomicon by Neal Stephenson. The timing of this puzzle is good.


_________________
In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and has been widely regarded as a bad move.” - Douglas Adams


Wed Mar 26, 2014 12:28 pm
Profile
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
Tenured Professor

BookTalk.org Moderator

Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 3564
Location: Michigan
Thanks: 1321
Thanked: 1149 times in 843 posts
Gender: Male
Country: United States (us)

Post Re: The A.S.P. Alphabet Soup Puzzle
Interbane,

Check out these two videos by Numberphile about the German Enigma machines.

Excellent.

Fun cipher info dump.

http://www.numberphile.com/videos/enigma.html

http://www.numberphile.com/videos/enigma_flaw.html


_________________
In the absence of God, I found Man.
-Guillermo Del Torro

Have you tried that? Looking for answers?
Or have you been content to be terrified of a thing you know nothing about?

Are you pushing your own short comings on us and safely hating them from a distance?

Is this the virtue of faith? To never change your mind: especially when you should?

Young Earth Creationists take offense at the idea that we have a common heritage with other animals. Why is being the descendant of a mud golem any better?

Confidence being an expectation built on past experience, evidence and extrapolation to the future. Faith being an expectation held in defiance of past experience and evidence.


The following user would like to thank johnson1010 for this post:
Interbane
Fri Mar 28, 2014 3:37 pm
Profile
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
BookTalk.org Hall of Fame

BookTalk.org Moderator
Gold Contributor

Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 6974
Location: Da U.P.
Thanks: 1041
Thanked: 2010 times in 1616 posts
Gender: Male
Country: United States (us)

Post Re: The A.S.P. Alphabet Soup Puzzle
That's good stuff. Stephenson write about the Enigma quite a bit in Cryptonomicon. I was just listening to a chapter about it this morning.


_________________
In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and has been widely regarded as a bad move.” - Douglas Adams


Fri Mar 28, 2014 4:33 pm
Profile
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
pets endangered by possible book avalanche

Diamond Contributor

Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 4898
Location: Florida
Thanks: 177
Thanked: 344 times in 294 posts
Gender: Male
Country: United States (us)

Post Re: The A.S.P. Alphabet Soup Puzzle
Possible hint:

Start from upper left corner. Divide ASP into blocks of 17 lines and 17 columns.
From each section take the first 7 characters of the bottom line.
These represent a little-endian number in base 25 with 'a' representing zero.
Divide that number by its ordinal index within the message, then divide that value by 50411. The result will yield the corresponding letter in the clear by indexing into the first 26 odd primes: that is a=3, b=5, c=7,...z=103; 107 represents a separator.

Does anyone understand this?


_________________
n=Infinity
Sum n = -1/12
n=1

where n are natural numbers.


Tue Apr 01, 2014 8:17 pm
Profile Email
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 14 posts ] • Topic evaluate: Evaluations: 1, 5.00 on the average.Evaluations: 1, 5.00 on the average.Evaluations: 1, 5.00 on the average.Evaluations: 1, 5.00 on the average.Evaluations: 1, 5.00 on the average. 



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 7 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:

BookTalk.org Newsletter 

Announcements 

• Promote Your Fiction Book on BookTalk.org
Sun Jul 30, 2017 7:33 pm

• Promote Your Non-Fiction Book on BookTalk.org
Sun Jul 30, 2017 7:18 pm

• What's next on our Short Story menu?
Mon May 22, 2017 8:29 pm



Site Resources 
HELPFUL INFO:
Forum Rules & Tips
Frequently Asked Questions
BBCode Explained
Author Interview Transcripts
Be a Book Discussion Leader!

IDEAS FOR WHAT TO READ:
Bestsellers
Book Awards
• Book Reviews
• Online Books
• Team Picks
Newspaper Book Sections

WHERE TO BUY BOOKS:
• Great resource pages are coming!

BEHIND THE BOOKS:
• Great resource pages are coming!

PROMOTE YOUR BOOK!
Advertise on BookTalk.org
How To Promote Your Book

Featured Books

Books by New Authors


*

FACTS is a select group of active BookTalk.org members passionate about promoting Freethought, Atheism, Critical Thinking and Science.

Apply to join FACTS
See who else is in FACTS







BookTalk.org is a thriving book discussion forum, online reading group or book club. We read and talk about both fiction and non-fiction books as a community. Our forums are open to anyone in the world. While discussing books is our passion we also have active forums for talking about poetry, short stories, writing and authors. Our general discussion forum section includes forums for discussing science, religion, philosophy, politics, history, current events, arts, entertainment and more. We hope you join us!


Navigation 
MAIN NAVIGATION

HOMEFORUMSOUR BOOKSAUTHOR INTERVIEWSADVERTISELINKSFAQDONATETERMS OF USEPRIVACY POLICYSITEMAP

OTHER PAGES WORTH EXPLORING
Banned Book ListMassimo Pigliucci Rationally SpeakingOnline Reading GroupTop 10 Atheism Books

Copyright © BookTalk.org 2002-2018. All rights reserved.
Display Pagerank