tat tvam asi wrote:Native, you seem a bit confused for sure. The ancients saw the sun move across the sky all day. In those times movement was associated with chariot travel here on earth. So they mythologized the sun as being pulled across the sky, every day, by a mythological chariot ride across the sky. Whether the sun was personified as male or female, doesn't matter. In both cases the sun (whether viewed as male or female) was moving across the sky.
Now earlier than this the Egyptians used the analogy of the scarab beatle because it rolled along a ball of dung across the ground. So the sun was mythologized as rolled along through the sky by the scarab beatle. The chariot is just another edition to the old myth of the suns daily movement based on the same type of mythologizing analogy found in Egypt much earlier.
tat tvam asi,
To cut straight to the point: I´ll bet you that the mythological Scarab Beatle represents the mythical “first upheaval of soil” on the (Ra) enlightened Primeval Mound in the creation story, not “a puller of the Sun”.
1) The Dung Beetle species was worshipped by the ancient Egyptians as an embodiment of the god Khepri.
2) In Egyptian mythology, Khepri (also spelled Khepera, Kheper, Chepri, Khepra) is the name of a major god.
3) Khepri was identified as the aspect of Ra which constitutes only the dawning sun (i.e. the sun when it comes into being).
AD: Now, Is it the sun that comes into being in this mythical telling? Or is it “the soil on the (Ra) enlightened Primeval Mound that comes into being”?
Note especially the sentence in § 3:
“. . . constitutes only the dawning sun”. Only the dawning – nothing else! Except from the fact that it is not “the sun”, but the first Ra light of/on the Primeval Mound.
From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ogdoad we have the telling of the elementary deities who are immanent present before the story of the physically creation begins.
“The eight deities were arranged in four female-male pairs: Naunet and Nu, Amaunet and Amun, Kauket and Kuk, Hauhet and Huh. The females were associated with snakes and the males were associated with frogs. Apart from their gender, there was little to distinguish the female goddess from the male god in a pair; indeed, the names of the females are merely the female forms of the male name and vice versa. Essentially, each pair represents the female and male aspect of one of four concepts, namely the primordial waters (Naunet and Nu), air or invisibility (Amunet and Amun), darkness (Kauket and Kuk), and eternity or infinite space (Hauhet and Huh).
Together the four concepts represent the primal, fundamental state of the beginning, they are what always were. In the myth, however, their interaction ultimately proved to be unbalanced resulting in the arising of a new entity.
When the entity opened, it revealed Ra, the fiery sun, inside. After a long interval of rest, Ra, together with the other deities, created all other things”.
AD: After a certain amount of interaction between the 4 (8) elements of Ogdoad, the physically creation first shows a great fiery light, Ra, as a result of swirling and merging elements. In this process everything is created, including the first soil that becomes land i.e. planets later on.
The Dung Beetle, Khepri God, is connected to Ra in the sense that it represents the first soil/land that is created, is pushed up, and this creates the firm land that again becomes the Primeval Mound. In this sense the Dung Beetle also allegorical represents the eternal creation.
From
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_Egyptian_ ... tion_myths
The sun
(Read: Ra, The First Light on the Primeval Mound – Native) was also closely associated with creation, and it was said to have first risen from the mound, as the general sun-god Ra or as the god Khepri, who represented the newly-risen sun
(Read: Ra, The First Light on the Primeval Mound – Native). There were many versions of the sun's emergence,
(Read: Ra, The First Light on the Primeval Mound – Native) and it was said to have emerged directly from the mound or from a lotus flower that grew from the mound, in the form of a heron, falcon, scarab beetle, or human child.
Another common element of Egyptian cosmogonies is the familiar figure of the cosmic egg, a substitute for the primeval waters or the primeval mound. One variant of the cosmic egg version teaches that the sun god,
(Read: Ra, The First Light on the Primeval Mound – Native) as primeval power, emerged from the primeval mound, which itself stood in the chaos of the primeval sea.
AD: Here it all comes together: The Dung Beetle represents the First Land on the Primeval Mound. In this sense the Beetle is connected to the First Light and Primeval Power of Ra on this Mound which mythologically also is connected to the mytheme of the Cosmic Egg from where everything comes into physically being.
Conclusion: The Dung Beetle has nothing directly to do with our Sun at all. The Beetle itself represents the mytheme of “soil upheaval” and creation of the Primeval Mound and land/planets as such. And Ra have nothing directly to do with our sun either. Ra cannot possibly and mytho-logically have anything directly to do with the sun because the solar system itself was not even created in this stage of the story of creation.
But of course both Ra and the Dung Beetle have something indirectly to do with the further creation out from the Primeval Mound because everything in our Milky Way is created out from this centre of creation, biblically called the Garden of Eden. Even our solar system was clearly created out of the Milky Way centre because it is obviously an orbiting part of the Milky Way rotation.
The confusion of Light
- In the scholarly interpretation, this light mytheme of Ra = The First Light, is confused because the scholars for some reason or another ignores/fails to connect the right mythological telling with the right cosmological object.
Knowing nothing or very little of the Milky Way creation, some scholars confuse the primary Milky Way First Light of the Primordial Mound with the secondary light of the Sun which of course gives a mythological and cosmological distorted telling that lacks logics.
So tat tvam asi: What do you bet?
NB: For a more specific and alternative explanation of the creation read here:
jcf.org/new/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3701& ... p;start=15
Post subject: 01. Milky Way Mythology; Post subject: 02. Milky Way Myth Basics; (Post subject: 03. Interpreting Deity Myths); Post subject: 04. Basically Symbols of Creation.
Cheers Native