I've always wanted to know this. Who wrote and how did they write the:

a) Bible

b) Qu ran/Koran

c) Torah/Pentateuch/Tanakh

From my observations in life I've seen people take the written word quite literally and if that's what works for them, fine. I respect that. But I wonder if anybody else besides myself wonders how say, the book of Ruth was actually put together and how it was done or how Christians absolutely know factually that Christ and the Virgin Mary really existed, the Muslims know that Allah and Muhammud existed and why it took 20 to 25 years to write the Koran and how exactly that was done. How and why did Judaism only take the first 5 books of Moses - did he really exist??? - and how did that morph into 613 commandments? And that's not even the tip of the iceberg.

I spend a lot of time thinking about these things as I am an inquisitive person who loves to learn new things daily and I wonder how many others are like me or are most devout followers of their faith totally without questions and just blindly and literally follow as I've seen in my experiences.

Here is a link to an interesting site I found this week: bib-arch.org/e-features/searching-for-b ... r-text.asp

It seems like some of that is what our next book will be about: The History of God. Scholars spend their whole lives studying all of the questions that you have. And there are a lot of disagreements among scholars and practitioners of all three religious faiths over some of the answers. All of your questions are interesting.

By "our next book", could you clarify that please as I am sure to buy and read it PRONTO?

What else have you written? Just might be exactly my area of interest.

A really big question which blatantly showcases my complete and total ignorance is why after at least 3 or 4 thousand years Rabbis and scholars still feel the need to spend 5 years or more on a few words or a commandment, dissecting and analyzing it and getting 100's of different perspectives on how a Jew must observe that law. I find this amazing, curious and different. I do NOT mock it - let me be absolutely clear on this. I'm aware that many feel that they have to do this or for some strange reason their religion will die.

It's just one of my favorite areas of interest. The more I learn about the subject, the happier I am.

I'm sorry, it's The Evolution of God by Robert Wright. Our next non-fiction book. A really good author who explores some of those questions is Karen Armstrong, also. I have been reading her History of God in a book group that I go to. I think I got the two books mixed up. But it seems from just a perusal of Wright's book that his book is very historically based like her book is.

I am not sure what you mean by 'what else have I written?'. I try to read all of the books that we choose on Booktalk, for the most part, and I sometimes comment on those. I really like feminism, religion, and literature. So I sometimes like to comment on those subjects when they come up.

A really big question which blatantly showcases my complete and total ignorance is why after at least 3 or 4 thousand years Rabbis and scholars still feel the need to spend 5 years or more on a few words or a commandment, dissecting and analyzing it and getting 100's of different perspectives on how a Jew must observe that law. I find this amazing, curious and different. I do NOT mock it - let me be absolutely clear on this. I'm aware that many feel that they have to do this or for some strange reason their religion will die.

That is a good question. I am sure that different people would give you different answers. It may be because religious practice is so important to people that they want to get it right. And people disagree on what right is.

It's just one of my favorite areas of interest. The more I learn about the subject, the happier I am.

Cool.

That book looks might tasty to me. Indeed. I really would love to read it. Very much so. On the author's page I see:

"Customers Also Bought Items By:
Matt Ridley Geoffrey F. Miller
Richard Dawkins David M. Buss
Steven Pinker Carl Sagan
Daniel C. Dennett Edward O. Wilson
Nicholas Wade R. I. M. Dunbar
Karen Armstrong Pascal Boyer
Jared Diamond Robin Baker
Krista Tippett Martin Daly"

When you wrote" "It seems like some of that is what our next book will be about: The History of God" the word "our" meant you and your co-author, that you were writing a book. It did not occur to me that you meant BT.Org Book Discussions/Group. Our wires got crossed there.

That is a good question. Thank you.

I am sure that different people would give you different answers. True that.

It may be because religious practice is so important to people that they want to get it right. It sure looks that way. I find it very, very interesting and wonder about it a lot.

And people disagree on what right is. So true.

Thanks for your thoughts and input. Too bad I haven't read the book yet and I think I'm too new to join discussions anyway. Not clear on what I can and cannot do yet as a newbie. Joining a discussion on a book I've yet to read would expose me to nothing but "spoilers", no?

booklady wrote:I've always wanted to know this. Who wrote and how did they write the:

a) Bible

b) Qu ran/Koran

c) Torah/Pentateuch/Tanakh

I am not sure what you have in mind by your question. If you mean historically speaking, you will get a different answer than asking generally.

I would begin by revising your list a bit.

The Bible from a Christian perspective includes the Torah/Pentateuch/Tanakh as the Old Testament (accepted by the Jews), and the New Testament (which combined with the OT is accepted by Christians as the full Bible. The most common doctrine is that the books of the Bible were written by humans under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit.

The Koran is a different matter. It was written by Mohammed about 700 AD. While some people use Bibles are talismans, there is nothing in Jewish or Christian doctrine which ascribes power to the book iteslf. That is not true with respect to the Koran. My understanding is that the Koran is believed to possess its own spirituality and therefore one must handle is in special ways so as not to desecrate it.

Thank you kindly for your reply.

I am not sure what you have in mind by your question. If you mean historically speaking, you will get a different answer than asking generally.

I would begin by revising your list a bit.

The Bible from a Christian perspective includes the Torah/Pentateuch/Tanakh as the Old Testament (accepted by the Jews), and the New Testament (which combined with the OT is accepted by Christians as the full Bible. The most common doctrine is that the books of the Bible were written by humans under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit.

The Koran is a different matter. It was written by Mohammed about 700 AD. While some people use Bibles are talismans, there is nothing in Jewish or Christian doctrine which ascribes power to the book iteslf. That is not true with respect to the Koran. My understanding is that the Koran is believed to possess its own spirituality and therefore one must handle is in special ways so as not to desecrate it.

Gee, I took pains to be as clear as I could. That does not mean I did a good job though, obviously.

I do know what the Christian Bible is and what it contains as well as The Torah and Koran. I've done extensive reading on these subjects for years. I know the histories, when and where they were written, etc., etc.

The Muslims walked out of the desert some 2,000 to 3,000 years after the very first Hebrew yet ironically, Judaism is one of the world's smallest religions while the religion of Islam is the largest in the world. I eat this stuff right up. It fascinates me while it educates me.

I asked why did it take some 23 years for the Koran to be written. That's a pretty clear question. A trillion answers and theories. One thing I read repeatedly in many, many scholarly type books is that many experts are absolutely convinced that Jewish scribes were paid to write the Koran because back then 99.9% of the Muslims were illiterate and they list their proof point after point. Really tasty reading if you're into that kind of thing. The things you learn.

Anyway, thank you for that one answer. It helps. All my questions still remain. I'd LOVE nothing better than to know the answers. Maybe they're the type of questions that cannot be answered. I sure hope not.

Now this I did not come across and directly address one of my questions.

The most common doctrine is that the books of the Bible were written by humans under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit.

Could you elaborate? Translate what exactly does "written under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit mean"? We have no witnesses to any of the writings of any of these 3 holy books. Just folklore handed down from generation to generation. And tons of artifacts dug up during excavations and things like the Dead Sea Scrolls to authenticate/validate much of the writings, beliefs, practices and so on.

I better stop. This kind of thing could go on for years. Sorry people if I put you to sleep.

I think it would be a very good idea for me to stay out of both this thread and the politics one if there is a politics one. Spare you nice people from all my font.

booklady wrote:Thank you kindly for your reply.

I am not sure what you have in mind by your question. If you mean historically speaking, you will get a different answer than asking generally.

I would begin by revising your list a bit.

The Bible from a Christian perspective includes the Torah/Pentateuch/Tanakh as the Old Testament (accepted by the Jews), and the New Testament (which combined with the OT is accepted by Christians as the full Bible. The most common doctrine is that the books of the Bible were written by humans under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit.

The Koran is a different matter. It was written by Mohammed about 700 AD. While some people use Bibles are talismans, there is nothing in Jewish or Christian doctrine which ascribes power to the book iteslf. That is not true with respect to the Koran. My understanding is that the Koran is believed to possess its own spirituality and therefore one must handle is in special ways so as not to desecrate it.

Gee, I took pains to be as clear as I could. That does not mean I did a good job though, obviously.

I do know what the Christian Bible is and what it contains as well as The Torah and Koran. I've done extensive reading on these subjects for years. I know the histories, when and where they were written, etc., etc.

The Muslims walked out of the desert some 2,000 to 3,000 years after the very first Hebrew yet ironically, Judaism is one of the world's smallest religions while the religion of Islam is the largest in the world. I eat this stuff right up. It fascinates me while it educates me.

I asked why did it take some 23 years for the Koran to be written. That's a pretty clear question. A trillion answers and theories. One thing I read repeatedly in many, many scholarly type books is that many experts are absolutely convinced that Jewish scribes were paid to write the Koran because back then 99.9% of the Muslims were illiterate and they list their proof point after point. Really tasty reading if you're into that kind of thing. The things you learn.

Anyway, thank you for that one answer. It helps. All my questions still remain. I'd LOVE nothing better than to know the answers. Maybe they're the type of questions that cannot be answered. I sure hope not.

Now this I did not come across and directly address one of my questions.

The most common doctrine is that the books of the Bible were written by humans under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit.

Could you elaborate? Translate what exactly does "written under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit mean"? We have no witnesses to any of the writings of any of these 3 holy books. Just folklore handed down from generation to generation. And tons of artifacts dug up during excavations and things like the Dead Sea Scrolls to authenticate/validate much of the writings, beliefs, practices and so on.

I better stop. This kind of thing could go on for years. Sorry people if I put you to sleep.

I think it would be a very good idea for me to stay out of both this thread and the politics one if there is a politics one. Spare you nice people from all my font.

Don't be sorry. I love to 'discuss' this 'stuff'

Actually, you are bit off on the relative number of adherants. Christianity is the largest @ about 35% of the world's pop, followed by Muslim at 20% and Atheism a little less. http://www.adherents.com/Religions_By_Adherents.html

I will spare you the argument for now about Christianity not being a religion and mention only as a place holder and to be consistent with my prior posts as there are watchers. As for the relatively low number of Jews, you must remember that while Christianity and Muslim's proselytize, the Jews do not. Normally you are born a Jew and do not convert. Your other questions about inspiriation, number of laws, etc. will be addressed. I have been trying to get people to participate in a book by book discussion of the Bible but so far the fear factor seems to be too great. You sound like you have enough interest to make it possible but I would like to hear you thoughts about the idea.

We can agree to disagree as we received our facts and figures from very different sources and I am loathe to belabour the point. No interest in that at all.

I am very, very interested but I've never read any of the 3 holy books so I'd be a poor candidate for that. Also, in the manner that they are written from what I have seen, it would take me eons to get through one passage, 20 lifetimes through one book. Plus I'm already loaded up on what I'm going to read for the next year or two. Well, almost.

I'm flattered and very grateful for your Huge and Very Generous offer. In my case, fear is in no way a factor. At all.

Take Care

Joining a discussion on a book I've yet to read would expose me to nothing but "spoilers", no?

But that is what this forum is about: reading intelligent books together. So you would not be joining in a discussion about a book you had never read. You would be discussing the book as you read it.