Hi Penelope,
Sometimes I type too quickly, my posting above was full of mistakes; the poll was "Muslim first" of course, not "Asian".
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VII- HD: colonialism at work.
- Penelope
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Well of course they would say Muslim first.....that is the dogma of their faith.....
But Muslims, like Christians - have different factions and points of view within their own faiths- one Christian point of view can be diametrically opposite to anothers in many cases, and the same goes for Islam, take Salman Rushdie as an instance.
It is just the fundamentalism that is impossible to take.....I can't stand fundamentalism in any shape or form.....Religious or Political......with the 'certainty' comes the 'inquisition' in my experience.
I'm all for a bit of woolley-minded liberal thinking.....
But Muslims, like Christians - have different factions and points of view within their own faiths- one Christian point of view can be diametrically opposite to anothers in many cases, and the same goes for Islam, take Salman Rushdie as an instance.
It is just the fundamentalism that is impossible to take.....I can't stand fundamentalism in any shape or form.....Religious or Political......with the 'certainty' comes the 'inquisition' in my experience.
I'm all for a bit of woolley-minded liberal thinking.....
- Ophelia
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cartoons
A blogger at Le Monde newspaper has published some interesting cartoons about the colonial past of four European countries: take your pick!
http://jcdurbant.blog.lemonde.fr/2006/0 ... ier_lhist/
http://jcdurbant.blog.lemonde.fr/2006/0 ... ier_lhist/
Ophelia.
- DWill
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Penelope,
Yes, it does seem to be true that certainty and conviction in matters of religion turn out to be destructive in one way or another. I wonder why this is, because certainty & conviction seem to be good things when not coupled with religion. I'm all for watered-down faith, too, if faith must exist. But that is anathema to believers, of course.
Will
Yes, it does seem to be true that certainty and conviction in matters of religion turn out to be destructive in one way or another. I wonder why this is, because certainty & conviction seem to be good things when not coupled with religion. I'm all for watered-down faith, too, if faith must exist. But that is anathema to believers, of course.
Will
- Penelope
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DWill - The fundamentalist/evangelical faiths insist on absolute conviction.
Fortunately, you can attend the Church of England if you don't believe in God at all. No one will challenge you, but you have to stand up and say the creed......which feels dreadful, if like me, you absolutely believe in God, but don't believe the dogma, or what I call the bllsht.
Still, I am sure it is what we 'do'.....not what we 'say' that counts.
Fortunately, you can attend the Church of England if you don't believe in God at all. No one will challenge you, but you have to stand up and say the creed......which feels dreadful, if like me, you absolutely believe in God, but don't believe the dogma, or what I call the bllsht.
Still, I am sure it is what we 'do'.....not what we 'say' that counts.
- Robert Tulip
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What a conundrum this is. The problem, as I see it, is that many faithful people are dogmatic about things that are simply false, such as the virgin birth. When our system is built upon a lie, it is rather like the statue described by Daniel with feet of clay. This is destructive. However, it should be possible to begin with scientifically verified statements and work from there to assess what religious claims are compatible. My belief system, which I know seems far-fetched, seeks to apply this approach. I think Will is correct that fervour about falsity is destructiveDWill wrote:Penelope, Yes, it does seem to be true that certainty and conviction in matters of religion turn out to be destructive in one way or another. I wonder why this is, because certainty & conviction seem to be good things when not coupled with religion. I'm all for watered-down faith, too, if faith must exist. But that is anathema to believers, of course. Will
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Penelope, DWill and Robert Tulip about religious belief
Please continue the very interesting discussion you started about religious belief on this thread, using the following link
http://www.booktalk.org/post30989.html#30989
(HD thread)
http://www.booktalk.org/post30989.html#30989
(HD thread)
Last edited by Ophelia on Thu Mar 06, 2008 8:42 am, edited 2 times in total.
Ophelia.
- Robert Tulip
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Sorry Ophelia, it is too easy to veer away from the subject at hand. I would rather if possible try to relate comments on religion to HD. Looking back over this thread, it seems the fact that the humanity of the Africans had an almost revelatory quality to Marlow inspired the comparison with religion. Falsity can be a powerful inspiration, as without a set of false convictions (Yeats' 'passionate intensity') the whole colonial enterprise would have foundered in uncertainty. Racism was an essential motivating rationale. Without the underlying fundamentalist beliefs in European superiority and divine right of conquest (Honi Soit) it would have been hard to ignore the clinking of the chains. For those raised with an assumption of cultural relativism an absolutist outlook seems utterly evil, whereas the absolutist sees the relativist as insipid and incapable of action.
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OK Robert, I'll leave the thread for religious belief in HD then, having two at this stage would be confusing.
So the link is:http://www.booktalk.org/post30989.html#30989
So the link is:http://www.booktalk.org/post30989.html#30989
Ophelia.