Use this thread for discussing Chapters 10 through 12 or create and use your own threads.

Edited by: Chris OConnor  at: 4/10/06 4:53 pm

what?! No posts on the ending!

How can that be?

For what's it's worth, I liked it. I had contemplated the idea that they might let him battle without telling him it was for real, but put the book down for a few days and didn't think about it again until after the final battle.

I really like how Card kept the story going with the story of the giant land and how they stored an egg in a place where ender would find it. Also, it was interesting how he kept looking for a place to let it be. Or do you think that was code for 'ender would not let it happen'? it must be heady to have that kind of power over a species, especially and intelligent one.

Further, do you think Ender was waiting for humans to become more compassionate before he released the egg? Perhaps that is what Card is saying: People will be people and not change, even after we colonize the universe.

After reading Speaker, I think Ender did not even consider humanity in his mission to place the egg sack. He realized that humanity was not ready for compassion...as we see still in SPeaker...3000 years after the events in "Game". He was in communication with the Bugger queen and it was strickly his mission for her. It was all about the two of them.

Quote:

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the story of the giant land

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What I wonder is: Did the computer and Ender come up with the fantasy land after the Giant, or were the buggers communicating with Ender during the desktop game? Were they sending him messages?

Mr. P.

The one thing of which I am positive is that there is much of which to be negative - Mr. P.

Once you perceive the irrevocable truth, you can no longer justify the irrational denial. - Mr. P.

The pain in hell has two sides. The kind you can touch with your hand; the kind you can feel in your heart...Scorsese's "Mean Streets"

I came to kick ass and chew Bubble Gum...and I am all out of Bubble Gum - They Live, Roddy Piper

Quote:

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What I wonder is: Did the computer and Ender come up with the fantasy land after the Giant, or were the buggers communicating with Ender during the desktop game? Were they sending him messages?

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SPEAKER FOR THE DEAD SPOILERS BELOW!!!













Speaker For The Dead seems to indicate through Jane that the computer adapted to Ender after the Giant since the Giant was the end of the regular known program. Speaker For The Dead does not indicate that the Buggers were involved with the construction of the fantasy land beyond the giant. That was the big question for the book that really never was fully addressed, how the Buggers knew. I guess through the ansible and Ender being so compassionate and feeling, they were able to "read" his memory in a way.

SPEAKER FOR THE DEAD SPOILERS BELOW!!!













So...the computer adapted some rudimentary intelligence? Was this the start of Jane? Hmm...

The Buggers did communicate with Ender on a somewhat telepathic level...it seems to have been described as something other than telepathy if I remember correctly. So maybe they did read his mind. But taking the Ender's Game book by itself...I was drawing the conclusion that the Buggers somehow were able to manipulate the program...but maybe I am off the mark.This thought kept recurring in my mind while I was reading though.

Mr. P.

The one thing of which I am positive is that there is much of which to be negative - Mr. P.

Once you perceive the irrevocable truth, you can no longer justify the irrational denial. - Mr. P.

The pain in hell has two sides. The kind you can touch with your hand; the kind you can feel in your heart...Scorsese's "Mean Streets"

I came to kick ass and chew Bubble Gum...and I am all out of Bubble Gum - They Live, Roddy Piper

Mr. P,

With your assumption: that we don't take the sequel into account, I agree that the buggers had a way into the game. What's not as clear is if they could actually manipulate it or had kind of a 'read only' access.

the spoiler is kind of interesting, though

For a while I entertained the notion that the Buggers used the game to lead Ender to find the cocoon. I am not so sure now, but that is what I thought before reading "Speaker". I think that Card meant to show that Ender controled the program and the program responded according to Ender's will.

I guess I am adding in my own twist with the whole Bugger thing come to think of it...but I like that twist!

Mr. P.

The one thing of which I am positive is that there is much of which to be negative - Mr. P.

Once you perceive the irrevocable truth, you can no longer justify the irrational denial. - Mr. P.

The pain in hell has two sides. The kind you can touch with your hand; the kind you can feel in your heart...Scorsese's "Mean Streets"

I came to kick ass and chew Bubble Gum...and I am all out of Bubble Gum - They Live, Roddy Piper

Xenocide sheds a little more like on the Bugger/Ender connection issue.