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POLL: Countdown to Impeachment
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- Chris OConnor
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Re: POLL: Countdown to Impeachment
I was reading what you said incorrectly. I thought you were only talking about the percentage that guessed that he would be impeached and you were talking about the percentage that got the time frame correct. Yes, I was way off by a few years.
So now we wait for the Senate to vote it down.
So now we wait for the Senate to vote it down.
- Taylor
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Re: POLL: Countdown to Impeachment
It’s more than just loading the courts. The GOP creepiness is all about their utter disregard for reality!, Their embrasure of the whole idea of PSfB’s innocence, That he alone is all about eliminating corruption, is the most laughable idea that can and is, being perpetrated on the public in human history. It is greater than the fraud of GOD. But! Because of the incredulity manufactured in an illiterate electorat that supports PSfB’s innocence, Fraud is given the time of day that it should not be given, and what’s worse is this Shit for Brains may get re-elected because of some weird notion of him rooting out this fantasy corruption and making America great again, it is , in their words a “coup”, Preposterous, gob smacking bull shit is presented here, there everywhere, Those same manufacturers of consent are pushing the horrors of a potential Warren or Sanders presidency in favor of the object of conspiracies Joe Biden, a further weirdness. Centrism keeps the balance point to the right. PSfB’s economy is a sham, it has not done the thing that was presented, It has not raised the standard of living, the status quo and population increase guarantees that. In other words, we are merely slinking along, while the real economic growth is in fewer hands. Hands that are gauntleted by an ancient armor, Libertarianism.
- DWill
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Re: POLL: Countdown to Impeachment
Just to acknowledge the moment: the count is over and he's impeached. I was reading about the derivation of "impeachment." One root may be a word meaning "to catch by the foot." Makes you think of someone stumbling into a trap. The country is divided over whether the trap was of his own making or was set by people who thought his presidency was illegitimate.
- Harry Marks
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Re: POLL: Countdown to Impeachment
Having heard the first day of the defense arguments, I am impressed by how willing lawyers are to push only their side of the story as if it is the whole story. Schiff and the Dems did more than a little of that, but the defense set many records for ignoring inconvenient information.
They made a big deal of the Ukrainians not knowing the aid had been withheld until Politico published it, as if they would have acted like the aid was in hand despite it not arriving and not arriving. They did not deal with Trump telling Zelinsky "Talk to Rudy" even though it's obvious Rudy was the channel for the backdoor pressure and Trump is hoping Rudy's status as attorney will shield him from having to face questions about what he was doing and why.
The defense intimated that the motivation for the hold was burden sharing, but nobody believes that. Burden sharing was obviously just as much on the agenda when the news came out through the whistleblower and the hold was dropped (like a hot potato) every bit as mysteriously as it was put in place originally. No explanations, everything "close hold", no diplomatic channels, no serious pressure on Germany despite Dear Leader's protestations.
The defense was a few threads dangled across the field of vision to give the impression that something was there, but it takes almost no thought to realize the threads amount to nothing. Still, in Fox News world, that's enough because motivated reasoning is the only kind of reasoning that goes on. The fig leaf is provided, and the Senators know what they have to do next to keep from being primaried by dark money and rabid Trumpistas.
They made a big deal of the Ukrainians not knowing the aid had been withheld until Politico published it, as if they would have acted like the aid was in hand despite it not arriving and not arriving. They did not deal with Trump telling Zelinsky "Talk to Rudy" even though it's obvious Rudy was the channel for the backdoor pressure and Trump is hoping Rudy's status as attorney will shield him from having to face questions about what he was doing and why.
The defense intimated that the motivation for the hold was burden sharing, but nobody believes that. Burden sharing was obviously just as much on the agenda when the news came out through the whistleblower and the hold was dropped (like a hot potato) every bit as mysteriously as it was put in place originally. No explanations, everything "close hold", no diplomatic channels, no serious pressure on Germany despite Dear Leader's protestations.
The defense was a few threads dangled across the field of vision to give the impression that something was there, but it takes almost no thought to realize the threads amount to nothing. Still, in Fox News world, that's enough because motivated reasoning is the only kind of reasoning that goes on. The fig leaf is provided, and the Senators know what they have to do next to keep from being primaried by dark money and rabid Trumpistas.
- LanDroid
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Re: POLL: Countdown to Impeachment
DOD received calls from Ukraine about the hold on aid on 7/25/19, the day of the infamous phone call. The Dept of State received similar inquiries within a week, so Ukraine understood the situation on military aid right away.Harry Marks wrote:They made a big deal of the Ukrainians not knowing the aid had been withheld until Politico published it, as if they would have acted like the aid was in hand despite it not arriving and not arriving.
One interesting but under-reported fact is the pressure on Zelensky began even before he was inaugurated. The prospect of high level American officials attending his inauguration was conditioned on Zelensky announcing investigations into Hunter Biden. VP Pence abruptly cancelled his trip to that ceremony just before it started because the announcement had not been made.
- geo
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Re: POLL: Countdown to Impeachment
A particularly damning fact about the campaign in Ukraine is that it was largely based on a conspiracy theory that was promulgated by Russia. I don't think Trump is a willing puppet of Russia, but he might as well be, since he so easily latches on to the right-wing conspiracy stuff. It's no wonder that Putin wanted Trump to be president.
Indeed, the now famous recording where Trump says, "take her out"—meaning get rid of Marie Yovanovitch, the U.S. ambassador in Ukraine, you can hear Lev Parnas goading the president to do it. The campaign to pressure the Ukraine was quite possibly largely Guilliani's pet project. Far from being a mastermind criminal, Trump is just basically incompetent. That's where we are. And that's also why the Senate will very likely not remove him from office.
Indeed, the now famous recording where Trump says, "take her out"—meaning get rid of Marie Yovanovitch, the U.S. ambassador in Ukraine, you can hear Lev Parnas goading the president to do it. The campaign to pressure the Ukraine was quite possibly largely Guilliani's pet project. Far from being a mastermind criminal, Trump is just basically incompetent. That's where we are. And that's also why the Senate will very likely not remove him from office.
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Question everything
- DWill
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Re: POLL: Countdown to Impeachment
The man has an enormous reserve of spite. Some say that, regarding Barack Obama, it originated in 2011 at the White House Correspondents' dinner attended by Trump, where Obama made jokes at the thin-skinned Donald's expense. Afterwards, of course, Trump's rise to prominence was aided by his aggressive promotion of birtherism. During his presidency, he has tried to tear down anything considered an achievement of Obama's. It's not unlikely that going after Obama's ex-VP was fed by Trump's hatred of all things Obama, with the election a secondary motive.
A pundit, Ruth Marcus, mentioned Chief Justice John Roberts' caution to members of both parties to temper their language within the precincts of "the world's greatest deliberative body," the Senate. But who, she asked, will caution the president, who assails the opposition as "sleazebags."? The depths to which Trump has brought the once-proud office are astonishing.
A pundit, Ruth Marcus, mentioned Chief Justice John Roberts' caution to members of both parties to temper their language within the precincts of "the world's greatest deliberative body," the Senate. But who, she asked, will caution the president, who assails the opposition as "sleazebags."? The depths to which Trump has brought the once-proud office are astonishing.
- Chris OConnor
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Re: POLL: Countdown to Impeachment
I'm going to remove this topic as a "sticky" thread since it doesn't look like Trump will be impeached.
- Harry Marks
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