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Should Donald Trump be awarded the Nobel Peace Prize? 

Should Donald Trump be awarded the Nobel Peace Prize?
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Should Donald Trump be awarded the Nobel Peace Prize? 
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Post Should Donald Trump be awarded the Nobel Peace Prize?
From CNN, two days ago:

Trump deserves Nobel for role in talks with North, South Korea's leader says

(CNN) South Korean President Moon Jae-in said Monday that US President Donald Trump would be a worthy winner of the Nobel Peace Prize for his involvement in the warming of relations with North Korea.

A former South Korean President, Kim Dae-jung, won the prize in 2000 for his role in setting up a previous summit with North Korea, and his widow suggested Monday that Moon should also get the award.

Moon demurred in response, saying the US President ought to get it instead. "President Trump should win the Nobel Peace Prize. The only thing we need is peace," Moon said during a Cabinet meeting on Monday, according to the Blue House, the South Korean presidential office.

cnn.com/2018/04/30/asia/south-korea-tru ... index.html

EDIT: I just went back and enabled the feature that allows you to change your vote. Trump can change things in the blink of a tweet, so it's only fair that we should also be able to change. And I think I've set the poll to expire at about the time the award is announced.


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Wed May 02, 2018 10:57 pm
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Post Re: Should Donald Trump be awarded the Nobel Peace Prize?
I'm afraid I don't follow the politics of this administration as thoroughly as I should, so I am not at all certain how much of this progress is actually progress and how much of it he is actually responsible for. I will be listening to the pundits and reading the articles for a few days until the next thing comes along.


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Fri May 04, 2018 12:58 pm
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Post Re: Should Donald Trump be awarded the Nobel Peace Prize?
Based on where things stand at the moment: No. However, if these talks lead to peace / denuclearization and Trump is critical to that process, then he would deserve the Nobel. (Otherwise I expect it would be awarded only to the two leaders of North and South Korea. Or the whole thing could fall apart as with previous initiatives from NK.) But what if Trump also starts a war with Iran, Syria, or elsewhere? That prize would have to be rescinded.



Sat May 05, 2018 11:13 am
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Post Re: Should Donald Trump be awarded the Nobel Peace Prize?
I have to vote No on this. Trump has killed since becoming president. He may have had sound reasons for killing but still, I have to vote no. And then there's the war cabinet he's assembling for Iran...

But he should be credited for breaking the stalemate on the Korean situation. From what I've read, he 1) insisted on REAL sanctions instead of just lip-service sanctions. He went head-to-head with China over this, and they blinked. NK suffered the loss of supplies even from China. Trump also 2) threatened to annihilate NK. Kim Jong-un seems to have taken him seriously because 3) Trump doubled down on war games that the US and allies were conducting in and around South Korea a few months ago. Kim finally snapped. He asked if he and his family would be spared during regime change. And then the flow of good news began.

In my opinion NK was finally faced with a US president who might actually carry through with regime change. Trump should be credited with a major international success if this works out, but no Peace Prize. I also think that Obama's Peace Prize should be rescinded. Didn't Jimmy Carter serve his entire term without involving the US in armed conflicts? Give him Obama's prize.


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Wed May 09, 2018 9:39 pm
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Post Re: Should Donald Trump be awarded the Nobel Peace Prize?
It's silly in the first place that a peace prize is given every year, regardless of whether a major achievement in advancing peace has really occurred. I'd favor abolishing the whole thing anyway, to avoid absurd situations like Aung San Suu Kyi of Myanmar, the 1991 winner, participating in the Rohingya genocide.



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Sat May 12, 2018 5:48 am
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Post Re: Should Donald Trump be awarded the Nobel Peace Prize?
Makes sense. Let's give Donald a peace prize for not starting a war yet. For not having done really much of anything yet except running his big mouth and getting himself in unnecessary trouble. Well, he has one big accomplishment: He's broken up a record number of families. Give him credit for that one, folks--he earned it.



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Post Re: Should Donald Trump be awarded the Nobel Peace Prize?
youtube.com/watch?time_continue=253& ... 838gS8nwas

Apparently that's a film that the Trump team showed to Kim Jong-un at the start of their one-on-one meeting. It's careful not to insult Kim and it dangles a big carrot in front of him. Trump will always be a real estate huckster. And maybe Kim wants nothing more than to have hotels and bikinis on his beaches. We shall see.


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Post Re: Should Donald Trump be awarded the Nobel Peace Prize?
I had to laugh at Trump's assessment of NK real estate potential. "They have beautiful beaches. You can see it whenever they show pictures of them shooting their cannons into the water." Not his exact words, but something genuinely funny there, I thought. There is some great comedy to made from this whole Trump thing, something way better than Alec Baldwin's flaccid imitations.



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Post Re: Should Donald Trump be awarded the Nobel Peace Prize?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZeiIH4IKL0U



Wed Jun 13, 2018 7:02 pm
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Post Re: Should Donald Trump be awarded the Nobel Peace Prize?
Kim Jong-un’s father was a movie enthusiast. He loved western cinema. He even kidnapped South Korea’s leading film director and held him for years in the north so he could make movies there. So Kim Jong-un probably has a special place in his heart for movies. Trump showing him a 4-minute film where he, Kim, is the hero, well that was probably quite exhilarating for Kim.

And the liberal media’s mocking of Trump for the video is expected. Democrats have been pissed off since they had their slaves freed. They’ve been pissed off since their Bolshevik soulmates lost the Cold War. Now they’re pissed off that Comrade Klinton wasn’t able to cheat her way into the White House.

Trump’s doing what he can to close the deal on North Korea, but I don’t expect he sees much beyond the real estate possibilities. He probably believes, truly believes, that building hotels will lead to a boom in the North Korean economy and the rest will take care of itself.

The problem is, Trump is serving the interests of globalism with this approach. In 20 years NK will be drowning in debt. The World Bank will see to that.

The World Bank and the International Monetary Fund are the United Nations’ banking arms. The IMF has 189 members at the moment, and there are only 195 countries in the world. Back when G.W. Bush listed his 7 Axis of Evil countries, the 7 were ones that didn’t have branches of the World Bank controlling their economies (central banks answerable to the World Bank). North Korea was at the top of the Axis list. So, NK has been in the World Bank’s crosshairs for a long time, and now Trump is showing their insane leader video puff pieces which end with NK as the jet-set’s new vacation spot. Kim won’t be able to resist the Hollyweirdness of it. He’ll sign NK on to ruinous loans, and eventually the World Bank will foreclose and take possession of the country. That’s communist totalitarianism, Rothschild-style.

There’s an interesting article called “The Globalizer Who Came In From the Cold,” written by Greg Palast back in 2001. Nobel Prize Economist Joseph Stiglitz ‘splained to Palast how the IMF and the World Bank take control of countries by bribing corrupt officials:

gregpalast.com/the-globalizer-who-came- ... -the-cold/

That article outlines what’s in store for North Korea if it takes the IMF’s money. Their future will resemble what Argentina’s going through now. The piece below talks about Argentina.

bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-06-07/ ... er-economy

Argentina was OK’d for a 50 billion dollar loan from the IMF a week ago. The IMF gets countries into a position where they can’t repay their loans, then they begin doling out money so that the desperate governments can pay the INTEREST on the loans. Of course that solves nothing, so another loan is arranged, then another... The Palast/Stiglitz article talks about it. Don’t believe the BS mainstream media when it says the IMF is performing humanitarian loans. The goal is to completely gut the borrowing countries.

And the Leftist media is clueless to what’s going on. In fairness I guess the Right is too. And it’s that ignorance that the totalitarian bankers count on. At the end of this Korean “peace process,” NK will be brought into the fold of the World Bank and there will be one less financial loose cannon in the world. The North Koreans’ new “prosperity” will be short-lived, but maybe they’ll be left with a nice golf course or two.


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Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:17 pm
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Post Re: Should Donald Trump be awarded the Nobel Peace Prize?
KindaSkolarly wrote:
And maybe Kim wants nothing more than to have hotels and bikinis on his beaches.


I am in favor of bikinis. All the more so in North Korea.



Sat Jun 16, 2018 2:49 am
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Post Re: Should Donald Trump be awarded the Nobel Peace Prize?
KindaSkolarly wrote:
In 20 years NK will be drowning in debt. The World Bank will see to that.

When the Debt Crisis hit in the early 80s, the fourth largest debtor country, measured in terms of medium-term debt vulnerable to the rise in the dollar and the rise in world interest rates, was South Korea. By the time Mexico, Brazil and Argentina were through negotiating theirs down, South Korea had paid theirs down by an equivalent degree (more, actually). I would not be worried about debt in NK.

KindaSkolarly wrote:
The World Bank and the International Monetary Fund are the United Nations’ banking arms.

Don't know where you get this. Neither one has any connection to the UN or follows any UN policy. There is some coordination on development strategy, but any high level policy resemblance is due to the same countries being influential in both.

KindaSkolarly wrote:
and eventually the World Bank will foreclose and take possession of the country. That’s communist totalitarianism, Rothschild-style.
The World Bank hasn't "foreclosed" on anyone yet. Their big threat is to be first in line for repayment in front of private banks, which is pretty much by everyone's common consent.

KindaSkolarly wrote:
Their future will resemble what Argentina’s going through now.
Argentina remains the only significantly-sized country to have completely defied the IMF. When they negotiated a private debt write-down in 2003 while defaulting on IMF loans, some people predicted economic disaster for Argentina, others predicted IMF irrelevance. Neither happened.

Argentina got itself in trouble by following monetarist (e.g. Wall Street Journal editorial page) advice to use a currency board to fix its exchange rate and money supply in the 90s. After six years of steady deterioration they gave up, not surprisingly, and actually began following sensible policies. The result was pretty good until Herbert Hoover Bush gave us the Great Recession in 2008.

KindaSkolarly wrote:
Argentina was OK’d for a 50 billion dollar loan from the IMF a week ago. The IMF gets countries into a position where they can’t repay their loans, then they begin doling out money so that the desperate governments can pay the INTEREST on the loans.

Actually, the IMF is a small-time lender. 50 billion sounds like a lot. Argentina owes something like 240 billion. But the 50 is a "war chest" to resist those betting against the peso. The government can draw on this credit line to buy pesos from those trying to unload them. If things go as expected (and since Argentina has put interest rates up to seriously high levels, they probably will) the loan will be easily repaid in a couple of years.

The serious problems come when countries try to resist devaluations in times when the U.S. dollar is rising, like the current one. (Most international debts are denominated in dollars. The combination of rising interest rates and a rising dollar is a tough one, but unlikely to replicate 1982, when the cost of debt service pretty much quadrupled in one year). Given that the IMF is on board, and Argentina's finances seem to be in the hands of well-trained economists (unlike some countries I could name), they will allow the peso to fall but at a measured rate. No panic at the exits. And before long the peso will reach a level at which exports exceed imports and it can make debt payments.

I staffed the Mexican peso crisis for our "political level" boss in 1995. I told him that the most likely outcome was early repayment of the loans, and that is what happened. Once you get a handle on the basic forces at work, these things are not so difficult to suss out.

I have a lot of respect for Stiglitz, but not so much for some of the people who interview him and write up their versions of his comments. He has some good critiques of IMF and World Bank policies, but he does not, in general, argue that they intentionally subvert governments or use corruption to increase their own power.

By the way, the IMF has not yet claimed to extend a loan on humanitarian grounds. They can be criticized for insisting that debts be repaid, but the enforcement is simply that a country which is not creditworthy won't get loans - from them or from the much larger flow of private lending.

The World Bank is also pretty hard-nosed, lending for long-term priorities like roads and dams and ports, not for humanitarian crises. In general, loans are not used for humanitarian crises by anyone, on the reasonable grounds that if the country had the resources to repay they would not have to borrow for food and tents in the first place.



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Post Re: Should Donald Trump be awarded the Nobel Peace Prize?
Try to justify the rapine all you want, but it can't be justified. The IMF and World Bank are the financial hammers of the U.N. They claim that they're helping to alleviate poverty and so on, but that's not true. The countries they "help" are left in debt, with the IMF at the head of the line demanding repayment. But that's not by "common consent" as you say, it's by consent of the corrupt officials who take out the loans on behalf of their countries.

And the system is acidic, always chewing away. Couple of months ago, this. Tell me again how the U.N. and the World bank aren't joined at the hip:

The United Nations and the World Bank Group Sign a New Partnership Compact for Lebanon
worldbank.org/en/news/press-release/201 ... or-lebanon

And blaming a reporter for misrepresenting...come on. If anything he held back. From his interview with Stiglitz, four steps were outlined. This is how the World Bank and the IMF "help" countries:

Step One is privatisation. Stiglitz said that rather than objecting to the sell-offs of state industries, some politicians - using the World Bank's demands to silence local critics - happily flogged their electricity and water companies. 'You could see their eyes widen' at the possibility of commissions for shaving a few billion off the sale price.

Step Two is capital market liberalisation. In theory this allows investment capital to flow in and out. Unfortunately, as in Indonesia and Brazil, the money often simply flows out. ... Stiglitz calls this the 'hot money' cycle. Cash comes in for speculation in real estate and currency, then flees at the first whiff of trouble. A nation's reserves can drain in days.

Step Three: market-based pricing - a fancy term for raising prices on food, water and cooking gas. This leads, predictably, to Step-Three-and-a-Half: what Stiglitz calls 'the IMF riot'. ... The IMF riot is painfully predictable. When a nation is, 'down and out, [the IMF] squeezes the last drop of blood out of them. They turn up the heat until, finally, the whole cauldron blows up,' - as when the IMF eliminated food and fuel subsidies for the poor in Indonesia in 1998. Indonesia exploded into riots. ... There are other examples - the Bolivian riots over water prices last year and, this February, the riots in Ecuador over the rise in cooking gas prices imposed by the World Bank....

Step Four: free trade. This is free trade by the rules of the World Trade Organisation and the World Bank, which Stiglitz likens to the Opium Wars. 'That too was about "opening markets",' he said. As in the nineteenth century, Europeans and Americans today are kicking down barriers to sales in Asia, Latin American and Africa while barricading our own markets against the Third World 's agriculture. ... In the Opium Wars, the West used military blockades. Today, the World Bank can order a financial blockade, which is just as effective and sometimes just as deadly....

Stiglitz has two concerns about the IMF/World Bank plans. First, he says, because the plans are devised in secrecy and driven by an absolutist ideology, never open for discourse or dissent, they 'undermine democracy'. Second, they don't work. Under the guiding hand of IMF structural 'assistance' Africa's income dropped by 23%.

theguardian.com/business/2001/apr/29/bu ... iness.mbas

Another system at play in all of this is the "Core and Gap Theory." Thomas Barnett came up with it and outlined it in his book The Pentagon's New Map, in 2004. The book justifies war. Basically, he says the first-world countries owe it to the third-world countries to destroy them and then expend first-world money on rebuilding them. In the process a grand redistribution of wealth will take place and the world will settle into some kind of second-world utopia.

nationalreview.com/2004/07/core-gap-map ... mas-owens/

Barnett's Core and Gap crap fits hand in glove with the IMF's rebuilding of devastated countries. The redistribution of wealth is Marxist, and the IMF practices are predatory capitalism. I don't know what that hybrid would be called except murder. In the end, once the wars are waged and the money is stolen, life expectancies go down, people die off. Depopulation is the motivator for the people who own and run the world. They kill us off any way they can. Defending their methods is self-destructive.


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