Interbane wrote:Stah: "Unless you refute my explanation with a specific demonstration that it is iwrong, I will be forced to conclude that your objection is shallow, baselss and indefensible."
There is no need to refute your interpretation. I accept the words as they are written in the bible, which is in error. Unless you can provide evidence for your interpretation, you are wrong by default.
Stah: "How would you convince an H to become an F?
How would you convince a non-H to become an F?."
Why be an F at all? Would it not be better to do away with anything that causes segregation amongst people? Explain where you are going with this silly hypothetical scenario so I can dismantle it.
You don't dismantle anything. You just revert to the old saws, 'you'r rationalizing,' or, 'everything in the Bible is in error so I need not answer.' I thought this was a site that valued discussion and free thought. That is obviously not correct. It is a forum for monolithic, repetitious individuals who lack creativity and the ability to mount anything other than a superficial critique.
I will double check my count, but I think I am at 10 refutations of objections to the Bible.
To the matter at hand.
I guess you might have had difficulty with reading comprehension in school as F's will result in the abolition of prejudice.
A moderately clever person would have recognized that the H's are Jews (Hebrews), the F's are Christians (fish was a symbol for Christians*)
*do you know why fish was the symbol for Christians?
Jesus was a Jew. After His resurrection, his disciples, who behaved cowardly after His death became fiery advocates for Christianity. As a result, many Jews became Christians, but so did many gentiles. This created problems. As pointed out in my little riddle, H's were taught to be racists. They hated gentiles, and now, they were being told that they would be brothers, and sisters with them. A group of Jewish Christians put forward the proposal that Christians be accepted, provided that the men be circumcised and that all obey the law of Moses. This group was opposed by another set of converted Jews, who advocated the abandonment of the Mosaic law and circumcision. This was not inconsequential for though the Greeks practiced their sport activities in the nude, they considered the exposed glans obscene, and therefore circumcision for them was not acceptable. The controversy reached a head (this excuse the pun) with the convocation of a meeting of the leaders of the church representing both sides of the issue
Acts 15 (New King James Version)
Conflict over Circumcision
1 And certain men came down from Judea and taught the brethren, “Unless you are circumcised according to the custom of Moses, you cannot be saved.” 2 Therefore, when Paul and Barnabas had no small dissension and dispute with them, they determined that Paul and Barnabas and certain others of them should go up to him Jerusalem, to the apostles and elders, about this question.
3 So, being sent on their way by the church, they passed through Phoenicia and Samaria, describing the conversion of the Gentiles; and they caused great joy to all the brethren. 4 And when they had come to Jerusalem, they were received by the church and the apostles and the elders; and they reported all things that God had done with them. 5 But some of the sect of the Pharisees who believed rose up, saying, “It is necessary to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.”
The Jerusalem Council
6 Now the apostles and elders came together to consider this matter. 7 And when there had been much dispute, Peter rose up and said to them: “Men and brethren, you know that a good while ago God chose among us, that by my mouth the Gentiles should hear the word of the gospel and believe. 8 So God, who knows the heart, acknowledged them by giving them the Holy Spirit, just as He did to us, 9 and made no distinction between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith. 10 Now therefore, why do you test God by putting a yoke on the neck of the disciples which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear? 11 But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ[a] we shall be saved in the same manner as they.”
12 Then all the multitude kept silent and listened to Barnabas and Paul declaring how many miracles and wonders God had worked through them among the Gentiles. 13 And after they had become silent, James answered, saying, “Men and brethren, listen to me: 14 Simon has declared how God at the first visited the Gentiles to take out of them a people for His name. 15 And with this the words of the prophets agree, just as it is written:
16 ‘ After this I will return
And will rebuild the tabernacle of David, which has fallen down;
I will rebuild its ruins,
And I will set it up;
17 So that the rest of mankind may seek the LORD,
Even all the Gentiles who are called by My name,
Says the LORD who does all these things.’
18 “Known to God from eternity are all His works.[c] 19 Therefore I judge that we should not trouble those from among the Gentiles who are turning to God, 20 but that we write to them to abstain from things polluted by idols, from sexual immorality,[d]from things strangled, and from blood. 21 For Moses has had throughout many generations those who preach him in every city, being read in the synagogues every Sabbath.”
I know there are a lot of words and that causes you ‘free thinkers’ problems.
What was the source of the radical change in the hearts of those Jews for whom the promised Messiah was now to be shared with the formerly repulsive Gentiles?
What was the motivation for a Gentile to become a Christian which at the time was perceived as just a subset of Jews?
What was the motivation for anyone to become a Christian, when that decision brought with it not only no temporal benefits, but likely severe temporal costs?
I anticipate that this might be the beginning of a discussion and if so I welcome it. However, if you find yourself unable to do anything other then raise the flag of rationalizing save yourself and me the time and trouble of posting a reply.