This was classic.

Why do single cell organisms develop complexity when they can survive without it?

Answer: Because they CAN!


Question: Why did the man climb the mountain?

Answer: Because it's there.


That was really deep, guys. It made me contemplate Man as dullard, climbing dumb mountain for no reason.


Here's another gem:

Given enough time and stuff, anything can happen.
By that logic, my pet rock "Sammy" will eventually learn to talk in about 2 billion more years cause anything can happen given enough time, up to and including SOMETHING FROM NOTHING.

Or wait.., something always existed, except that wacky entity some delusional people refer to as "God"

Ya'll have reached new intellectually exciting hights.




And the mystery of consciousness can not be considered a mystery because there are "explanations" for it and who knows what people might start to think about dumb nature if we question them.


But wait, given enough time, dumb nature can become smart.

Come on, guys.
Geez

ant wrote:

Or wait.., something always existed, except that wacky entity some delusional people refer to as "God"

Let me expand on this a little, guys:

Anthony Kenny is an agnostic philosopher. Here is an entry from Wiki:

Although deeply interested in traditional Catholic teaching and continuing to attend the Catholic mass,[2] Kenny now explicitly defines his position as an Agnostic, explaining in his What I believe both why he is not a theist and why he is not an atheist. His 2006 book What I believe has (as Ch 3) "Why I am Not an Atheist" which begins: "Many different definitions may be offered of the word 'God'. Given this fact, atheism makes a much stronger claim than theism does. The atheist says that no matter what definition you choose, 'God exists' is always false. The theist only claims that there is some definition which will make 'God exists' true. In my view, neither the stronger nor the weaker claim has been convincingly established". He goes on "the true default position is neither theism nor atheism, but agnosticism ... a claim to knowledge needs to be substantiated; ignorance need only be confessed."

It is my opinion that a large part of the attitude here is atheistic related, in that, there is an absolute refusal to admit ignorance.
The questions asked here in the post are largely unanswerable. "Why" questions are NOT answerable by science. Yet, the atheists in these posts look to science to answer any question presented.

"Why is there something rather than nothing?"

Answer: "Because anything can happen given enough time"

It's actually stunning that certain people who take pride in "rational" thought can be so satisfied with an answer so intellectually unsatisfying.
That is why we have philosophers and theologians: to pick up the lazy slack pure materialists are satisfied leaving behind.

Anthony Kenny wrote:

After all, if there is no God, then God is incalculably the greatest single creation of the human imagination. No other creation of the imagination has been so fertile of the ideas, so great an inspiration, to philosophy, to literature, to painting, sculpture, architecture and drama; no other creation of the imagination has done so much to stir human beings to deeds of horror and nobility, or set them to lives of austerity or endeavor.

I must say that Anthony did not mention science. And that is no doubt what matters most to certain, CERTAIN atheists who look to science for ultimate knowledge and ultimate truths. And there is no questioning science's contributions to the understanding of our natural realm. However impressive its accomplishments (no one here denies that) questions of meaning and value will forever be unanswered by science. Great accomplishments elsewhere in Mankind'd pool of knowledge are due to other realms of thought.
We must thank Mankind's collective pathological delusional relationship with this "God" shouldn't we??

But no, God only sends us flying into buildings!

This was classic.

Why do single cell organisms develop complexity when they can survive without it?

Answer: Because they CAN!

It may be hard to understand because you're thinking of bacteria as people. Just because a person 'can' do something doesn't mean he will do something, you're right. But bacteria aren't people. The forces involved are mechanistic and guided by rules. It's like throwing cube magnets into a plastic bucket then shaking. Every now and then, a complex form will be constructed, rather than the more common simplistic forms. Not because the magnets 'want' to form something more complex, or because they 'need' to form something more complex. But because the outcome is somewhere on the probability curve. It's a possible outcome, even though it's not one of the more likely outcomes. Given enough time, even the unlikely possibilities will happen.

This translates to the set of information-increasing mutations over time. There are a number of ways an organism's genetic code can increase in information between it and it's offspring. Eventually, these additions will result in the lottery ticket of a beneficial mutation. It's actually a quite simple concept that you seem determined to misunderstand.

Given enough time and stuff, anything can happen.
By that logic, my pet rock "Sammy" will eventually learn to talk in about 2 billion more years cause anything can happen given enough time, up to and including SOMETHING FROM NOTHING.

Given enough time and stuff, anything can happen.
Given enough time and stuff, anything in the set of possible outcomes can happen.

The difference between the two statements is all it takes to form a straw man. I agree with the second statement, but I don't agree with your statement. I don't believe it's possible for your pet rock to eventually talk. You form straw men all the time ant, and I don't think you even realize it.

It is my opinion that a large part of the attitude here is atheistic related, in that, there is an absolute refusal to admit ignorance.
The questions asked here in the post are largely unanswerable. "Why" questions are NOT answerable by science. Yet, the atheists in these posts look to science to answer any question presented.

"Why is there something rather than nothing?"

Answer: "Because anything can happen given enough time"

It's actually stunning that certain people who take pride in "rational" thought can be so satisfied with an answer so intellectually unsatisfying.
That is why we have philosophers and theologians: to pick up the lazy slack pure materialists are satisfied leaving behind.

A refusal to admit ignorance? Do I need to bold my sentences when I say that "I don't know" is an acceptable answer? Read through the posts here, you'll see a ready acceptance of our own ignorance. This is another straw man.

"Why is there something rather than nothing" is NOT answered with "Because anything can happen given enough time." You took the answer from a different question and applied it to a well-known and as yet unanswerable meta-question.

Our replies were to your question on single celled organisms becoming more complex. They weren't replies to how something came from nothing. I'll be glad to philosophize around that question, don't get me wrong. But that discussion doesn't fit in this thread.

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How could single celled organisms jump to complex multi-celled organisms? They don't jump. They slowly climb a hill in tiny steps that don't even seem like they are gaining elevation, until you turn around, look down, and realize "hey! i can see my house from up here!"




http://io9.com/marine-biologists-call-t ... -988669239

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pyrosome

Take a look at this thing. Or, these things, more accurately.

This in essence is a living transitional species from single celled organisms to multicelled organisms. This suggests any number of possible ways single celled organisms can benefit from living in close proximity to one another, and the portugese man of war shows an iteration a little further down the line toward a cohesive multi-celled organism with different cells performing different tasks.

Just like your organs do.

And interbane had that correction right...

NOT "anything can happen."

Anything that CAN happen will happen.

So, life as we know it can happen in conditions like those found on the earth. So life as we know it is impossible on the surface of the sun.

See? This is not an argument that literally anything you can think of, including a pet rock learning to speak, is possible. This argument does NOT say that. It says, "Anything that can happen, will happen, given enough time." That means the conditions have to be right for the event to happen.

So if Venus was absolutely perfect for supporting complex humanoid life... for ten years, then went to hell... then complex humanoid life could not have evolved there.

I know the waters of science are chilly, Ant, but dip those piggies anyway and don't pull a knee jerk screed when your toes get wet. Actually think a little bit before you say something that makes you look ridiculous.

Given enough time and stuff, anything can happen.
By that logic, my pet rock "Sammy" will eventually learn to talk in about 2 billion more years cause anything can happen given enough time, up to and including SOMETHING FROM NOTHING.

We have to take points off for stuff like this, Ant.

"It's not even wrong." refers to events like this where it's clear the argument has not even been understood well enough to correctly argue about it.

I am definitely in the anything can happen camp on this one. There is no reason that over enough time that anything is possible.

There is Darwinism to consider though....

This is not a directly related question but it's the first one I thought of when reading the header - Can God regenerate a severed limb, right now?

God will not do anything that isn't already determined by natural laws. He loves hiding.

Actually, I think it's because he doesn't have to prove shit to your ass.