Chapter 23: Maxwell and the nerds

Please use this thread to discuss Chapter 23: Maxwell and the nerds.

What an odd chapter.

I was glad to see Sagan mention Maxwell. I think he was a genius at least at the level of Einstein but he lost out to Albert for a number of reasons: 1) The hair, 2) photography, 3) his equations seen't as sexy, & 4) he was a devout Christian, he even wrote a hymn or two.

Now Sagan did mention the Christianity bit but it was barely mentioned. That is hard to justify in a book that invests so much time beating up on Christians.

Sagan is a terrible salesman for super colliders. According to him they cost $ billions to build but have no practical application. They might help discover a TOE, but I already have a TOE. So, why should tax money be spent to find another one?

A better way is what happened a year ago. I was in a room full of potential investors being pitched by a consortium of universities who have a boatload of research results on different subjects which need capital to develop them to all kinds of practical applications. That's kind of the difference between Einstein and Maxwell too. Few things in our daily lives intersect with Relativity, at least in ways which Newton couldn't' t handle, but Maxwell's equations affect nearly everything in our daily lives.

As for the Nerds, I was at university on the cusp of the transition to the pocket calculator (yup Maxwell's equations) and away from slide-rules (that's how you spotted hard science students - nerds, then a slide rule hanging from their belt, and size did matter. The pocket protector and tapped glasses was gone by then but there were occasional exceptions - like the exceptionally creepy guy I saw hanging around the TRI-DELT house one morning. He had a pocket protector, a slide rule on his belt, a brief case with a sticker on it which read, "BEWARE OF QUANTUM DUCKS - QUARK -QUARK, and I would bet no date with one of the TRI-DELTS. They did not date mortals.

in a book that invests so much time beating up on Christians.

Beating up on Christians, or beating up on aspects of Christian doctrine?

If a Hindu or an atheist discovered something first does it follow that a Christian could not have made the same discovery?

These are a couple of points that come to mind as I ponder your posts.

There is a prominent disdain against the metaphysical in D-HW but I was present when an unexplained phenomenon occurred. 1973, Gainesville, Florida, the Introductory Astronomy class would take a U of F van from campus to the observatory on Rosemary Hill. We met at the appointed time and the graduate student instructor, Andrew, unlocked the driver's door of the van. He then came around to unlock the passenger doors but he no longer had the key. A thorough search of the van, Andrew's person, and surrounding area including the area under the van was made but the keys were never found.

Fascinating man, great book.


Paul Dirac

stahrwe wrote:Fascinating man, great book.


Paul Dirac

Thanks for the recommendation.
It looks really good.
I must add it to my list.

Stahrwe wrote:There is a prominent disdain against the metaphysical in D-HW but I was present when an unexplained phenomenon occurred.

If it's unexplained, why do you present it as if it were supernatural?

I did not use the word supernatural. I said metaphysical.
I used that word for the reason that the keys were present on the scene.
PROOF
I arrived before Andrew and tried all the van's doors . They were all locked.
Other students arrived before Andrew but after me and also tried the doors. They were locked.
Andrew arrived and unlocked the driver's door.
He opened the door and left it open so the van' s interior lights were on.

He came around the front of the van but he no longer had the keys.

I have no rational explanation for what happened to the keys. To me that qualifies as a metaphysical experience.

Stahrwe wrote:I did not use the word supernatural. I said metaphysical.

I see nothing wrong with the word metaphysical, although Sagan might use the word differently. The patterns created by physical things are metaphysical, which is the basis of information. Metaphysical naturalism is based on this connotation.

Stahrwe wrote:I have no rational explanation for what happened to the keys. To me that qualifies as a metaphysical experience.

I guess I can't glean what you're trying to say when you use the word, since it does have various meanings. Experience is metaphysical in a sense, being more about the interaction of matter than matter itself. It's quite another thing to claim the event is supernatural, but you said that's not the case.