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2 ways to be an expert: Science or Fake it. 
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Post Re: 2 ways to be an expert: Science or Fake it.
Lets straighten you out , Johnson

First of all no one is an "expert" in the relm of quantum mechanics. Any quantum physicist will gladly admit to that.
You are being a silly little cheerleader here again - "Yay Science!"

Secondly, the laws that givern quantum phenomena, science can only describe( to a very limited degree)and treat as "brute" laws with zero explanation as to what it is that governs them. Most naturalists like yourself (although you seem to be more of an outdated atomist) sidestep meta questions naturally arising from QM because of the default answer being so unsatisfying - nature is dumb. and all we have is brute dumb laws that come into play for no rational reason that would imply intelligence.

Lastly, Deepak is a well educated doctor. although i would not agree it gives him license to speculate in the manner he does about QM, i certainly would tell you to shut your big mouth before asking him to.

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Last edited by ant on Sat Jul 06, 2013 5:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Sat Jul 06, 2013 5:29 pm
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Post Re: 2 ways to be an expert: Science or Fake it.
Quote:
Lastly, Deepak is a well educated doctor. although i would not agree it gives him license to speculate in the manner he does about QM, i certainly would tell you to shut your big mouth before asking him to.


Educated shmeducated. Just like well-educated YEC's, education is rationalized as it's ingested. Those who are better rationalizers can shoehorn nearly any new information into their worldview.


Quote:
Most naturalists like yourself (although you seem to be more of an outdated atomist) sidestep meta questions naturally arising from QM because of the default answer being so unsatisfying - nature is dumb.


I think johnson's answer will be similar to my own. The reason I sidestep meta-questions is that I don't have the answer to them. Saying "I don't know" is an honest answer. The most honest one, in my opinion. Yet when you reply with "I don't know" to questions that a YEC or other belief fundy throws at you, they scream at you for dodging the question. Or sidestepping the question. Accept "I don't know" as the answer.

Be wary of those who instead claim to have the answers. Men like Deepak Chopra, who has a fabricated worldview he sells to people for a profit. New age worldviews aren't as profitable as the old school ones such as Christianity, but that doesn't mean there isn't a niche in the market.


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Mon Jul 08, 2013 8:05 pm
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Post Re: 2 ways to be an expert: Science or Fake it.
Quote:
Lets straighten you out , Johnson


Haha, yeah. You do that, Ant. Let that wisdom shine down!

Quote:
First of all no one is an "expert" in the relm of quantum mechanics. Any quantum physicist will gladly admit to that.


Like this for instance. Let me bask in this radiant display of knowledge!

There certainly are experts in quantum physics. And Deepak Chopra is certainly not one of them. You like to think that the "quantum" must mean "nobody knows anything about this" physics.

Expert:

Image
Knows what he is talking about.

Bull-shitter:
Image
Doesn't know what he's talking about.

The physicists who use this know exactly what the standard model says is going to happen when they make their calculations. To a ludicrous degree of accuracy. Better predictions than have ever been made, by anybody else, using any other method, ever.

So these guys are all wandering around with a blind fold on?

What i've explained to you before and you've worked very hard not to aknowledge, is that what's difficult is to try to picture the interactions of QM in your head in terms of objects on human scales. Not in how QM works. They know perfectly well how it works. It's just hard to wrap your brain around it.

Quote:
Secondly, the laws that givern quantum phenomena, science can only describe( to a very limited degree)and treat as "brute" laws with zero explanation as to what it is that governs them.


If by that you mean, with more accuracy than anything that has ever been uttered by a human mouth in history, you are right on the mark.

But what you are really complaining about here is that we've nailed down the how of QM, but not the why. We don't know the why, but that hasn't prevented us from using it to revolutionize the world. How you like that computer? Well the transistors that make it work rely on quantum mechanics. And you know computers, just whizzing boxes full of who-knows-what...

Nobody knows anything about them.

Quote:
Most naturalists like yourself (although you seem to be more of an outdated atomist) sidestep meta questions naturally arising from QM because of the default answer being so unsatisfying - nature is dumb. and all we have is brute dumb laws that come into play for no rational reason that would imply intelligence.


To you, it may sound unsatisfying. But so what if you are not satisfied? I have had no difficulty saying things to you that i know you won't like to hear. Hasn't made me side step saying them.

And once again you are pushing your failing off onto others. You think people dodge meta questions BECAUSE they don't imply an underlying intelligence? No. They give answers to you which don't imply an underlying intelligence, so you THINK those answers are a dodge. Because they didn't say what you wanted them to say. So they must be avoiding "the truth". Understand?

You came to the table expecting everyone to point at a mysterious invisible entity which set everything up, then get sad when they not only don't say that, but seemingly are perfectly fine with the evidence which suggests one isn't even necessary.

Quote:
Lastly, Deepak is a well educated doctor. although i would not agree it gives him license to speculate in the manner he does about QM, i certainly would tell you to shut your big mouth before asking him to.


On what basis, exactly? Is the fact that Chopra went to medical school, and after having studied what has been demonstrated to work for certain, instead chose the path of "alternative" medicine, which has not been demonstrated to work in the least as his career path... is that what's impressed you about his credentials?

This just makes him more of an idiot.

And in any case, i consider your credibility here pretty low, so i am not overly concerned to hear you would rather hear Deepak Chopra than me.

Anyway, carry on Anting.


_________________
In the absence of God, I found Man.
-Guillermo Del Torro

Have you tried that? Looking for answers?
Or have you been content to be terrified of a thing you know nothing about?

Are you pushing your own short comings on us and safely hating them from a distance?

Is this the virtue of faith? To never change your mind: especially when you should?

Young Earth Creationists take offense at the idea that we have a common heritage with other animals. Why is being the descendant of a mud golem any better?

Confidence being an expectation built on past experience, evidence and extrapolation to the future. Faith being an expectation held in defiance of past experience and evidence.


Tue Jul 09, 2013 12:49 pm
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