XI- HD, depression and PICS of the Congo.

Ophelia · Mon Feb 04, 2008 5:11 pm

XI- HD, depression and PICS of the Congo.

Penelope wrote:

"It is such a bleak book - and although I admire the technique - I really don't view life like Conrad - I have enjoyed it immensely but I do think it is the work of a depressive character. I like the character Marlowe, but I felt I was listening to a depressed friend, getting it all off his chest. "

1-Do you associate HD with depression?

Is Marlow a depressive character?

2- As I was considering this, I found wonderful pictures of the Congo River
(go down to the bottom of the page to see the Congo Falls as well).

Note: after reading Robert and Dwill 's feedback about the link below:
the link only seems to work for a short time.

As I think those photos are important: you can access themm by googling:

hubpages heart of darkness.

http://hubpages.com/hub/Heart-of-Darkness

Any comments about the pictures in relation to the novella?]

Robert Tulip · Mon Feb 04, 2008 11:43 pm


	Ophelia wrote: XI- HD, depression and PICS of the Congo. 1-Do you associate HD with depression? Is Marlow a depressive character? 2- As I was considering this, I found wonderful pictures of the Congo River (go down to the bottom of the page to see the Congo Falls as well). http://hubpages.com/hub/Heart-of-Darknesshttp://hubpages.com/hub/Heart-of-Darkness Any comments about the photos in relation to the novella?

This has to be about the most depressing book you could read. Marlow is a flinty realist, stoically observing the horror of colonialism with no power to do anything about it. Relentless evil is such a bummer. The things I find most depressing in the book are the awful ignorance on the part of most of those cheerily inflicting the greatest destruction, the knowledge of Kurtz

Ophelia · Tue Feb 05, 2008 1:36 am

Penelope · Tue Feb 05, 2008 10:45 am

I have to admit that whilst I was reading this book, I thought, the narrator might have noticed and mentioned something breathtakingly beautiful about the scenery. That is why I thought it seemed like the discription of a nightmare.

Even if you felt lost in an alien environment - usually you see, hear or feel something that gives you joy - or at least makes you laugh!!

Only in a nightmare would you perceive nothing but fear on such a journey.

Penelope · Tue Feb 05, 2008 1:17 pm

Robert said:-

Without understanding we are condemned to repeat the mistakes of the past.

Now, I am not being racist - I think I am probably being 'age-ist'

It srikes me that 'some' aspects of life have to be experienced to be understood.....well, I certainly don't think I understand much....the older I get the less I know....however, I do know that some days, I get up and I can only see the weeds in the garden and the dust in the house. Other days, all that doesn't matter, I can see the joy and beauty of it all.

I can empathise with Conrad (Marlowe) - and I can certainly admire his narrative style - but he does seem to have lost his joy. As you say, when diabolical heartless, cruelty seems relentless, it is a ' bummer'' (your word Robert) but usually there is some small thing to lift the spirit. I don't think we should accept the 'Heart of Darkness' in us all - but seek the 'Soul of Light' in us all. Ivory.....what a useless, cruel, stupid thing seek!

Perhaps he should have been examining his motives?

DWill · Tue Feb 05, 2008 10:42 pm

I haven't even had a chance yet to reread all of this novella. I wasn't able to open the pictures, but great idea to provide them. I imagine they do show quite a different aspect of the Congo River area than we see in the book? As to the reason for the gloom, could it be that Conrad has written a moral tale, a little allegorical even, in which both setting and some of the people are shown in single aspects? I think of Hawthorne's techniques as being slightly similar. We know that it really can't be true that the Congo is threatening, putrefying, and dark all the time. We know it can't be true that all the native people are dedgraded, stripped of humanity. But that is how Conrad shows them to us, perhaps in order to tell his moral tale most powerfully.

Conrad may have taken a journey similar to Marlowe's, but I tend not to think this book reflects his actual experience as much as that experience transmuted to art.

Ophelia · Wed Feb 06, 2008 3:12 am

Thanks for your input DWill.

Yes, the link I provided only seems to work only for a short time.

As I think those photos are important: you can access them by googling:

hubpages heart of darkness.

Penelope · Wed Feb 06, 2008 5:32 am

DWill - Thanks for that - I think you might be right as to why Conrad made it so gloomy.

Does that mean he was using rhetoric? Is it a rhetorical fable?

Ophelia · Wed Feb 06, 2008 4:02 pm

About rhetoric:

This is a very general term. I've looked up my literary term reference books (which incidentally hadn't happened on my shelves for a long time) and skanned through the many pages:

"Rhetoric is the art of using language for persuasion, in speaking or writing"
(J A Cuddon, A Dictionary of Literary Terms)

When studying twentieth century fiction, the term is used mostly as rhetorical figures, which takes us to figurative language and figures of speech.

Penelope · Wed Feb 06, 2008 4:43 pm

Ah, you see, I thought rhetoric meant - overstating and dramatising your argument in order to persuade people.

Some of our MP's (usually Welshmen) are accused of using 'pure rhetoric' to argue their case in parliament.

They have wonderful voices, usually, and Welsh is a delightful accent to my ears. You know - Dylan Thomas:- Rage, Rage against the dying of the light - is that not an example of rhetoric?

Penelope · Wed Feb 06, 2008 5:21 pm

This message has been deleted by Penelope - but only because it was a cartoon picture too small to read. NOT BECAUSE IT WAS RUDE!!!

Ophelia · Wed Feb 06, 2008 5:26 pm

Penelope,

Yes, "rhetoric" also means this, and a few other things in literature.

For me the many different meanings make the word difficult to use.

Penelope · Wed Feb 06, 2008 5:33 pm

Oh I'm really sorry - that is too small to read. I hope that last post will be deleted.

Here is a larger one;

http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff15 ... igRhet.gif

Ophelia · Wed Feb 06, 2008 5:50 pm

Lovely big cartoon Penelope!

It took me a little while to understand about deleting.
You can delete your own posts if/when a delete box ( an X) is apparent in the top right- hand corner. I think you are given the opportunity when you have just posted, but not later.
This explains why BT readers will occasionally get an empty posting by me-- the solution I found when I had changed my mind, too late: I withdraw the content, leaving only two random letters: not exactly neat, but not much harm done.

Has anybody found a better way of deleting when the box doesn't appear?

DWill · Thu Feb 07, 2008 7:10 pm

Not sure about Conrad's reason for giving the story such nightmare qualities, but as I reread it I also picked up his references to fever and perhaps mild delirium. By his state of mind, maybe he was less capable of seeing that landscape as anything but nightmarish. Of course, he was also under a fair amount of stress, not acting the part of the typical ecotourist!

Will

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