Women should be seen but not heard

Interbane · Mon Oct 19, 2009 1:35 pm


	Quote: Deceivers

*hands Stahrwe a mirror.

seespotrun2008 · Mon Oct 19, 2009 2:04 pm


	Quote: Deceivers

Who is that? I mean in order to call someone an enemy you have to separate yourself from them. They lose their humanity. This is how and why wars get started.

CWT36 · Sat Oct 24, 2009 12:32 am

Stah -

In perusing the Southern Baptist Convention website I came across this publication published by the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary:


	Quote: Modeling Modesty This booklet by Mary K. Mohler addresses the important topic of modeling and teaching modesty in women. http://www.sbts.edu/resources/files/200 ... -24-09.pdf

Since you have stated that your denomination does not believe in the subjugation of women, why is there no corresponding booklet that "addresses the important topic of modeling and teaching modesty in [men]?"

seespotrun2008 · Sat Oct 24, 2009 4:58 am

Wow, and that is recent. I love how we criticize Muslims for the way we treat women when we are just as sexist on many levels.

seespotrun2008 · Sat Oct 24, 2009 5:52 am

Wow. I think wearing Burkas would be easier. That takes away any choice. And once again blaming women for rape. 'You have to be in control of what you wear because men are just incapaple of having any contol around women who do not dress modestly'.

Frank 013 · Sat Oct 24, 2009 11:07 am

It continuously amazes me how Star starts these threads with the intent of showing us all the truth of his claims and belief… and then how badly he gets embarrassed… the worst part is that he does not even realize how badly he is being humiliated.

Later
:laugh:

johnson1010 · Sat Oct 24, 2009 11:37 am

Well Frank, that's because we are not worthy of hearing the absolutely amazing, completely convincing evidence that Star is holding back from us.

You will note in many of these conversations he makes allusions to mind blowing proof that he is keeping in his back pocket, just in case someone manages to really challenge one of the holy doctrines.

If he were ever to show this amazing truth to our un-enlightened minds, our faces would melt off like the nazi's in front of the ark.

be thankful he only argues with half a mind Frank.

CWT36 · Sat Oct 24, 2009 6:56 pm

The following is taken directly from an article on the Southern Baptist Convention website (emphasis mine):

http://www.sbc.net/redirect.asp?url=htt ... SEMINARIES


	Quote: 4. It is easy for the man to hold to a hierarchical position since men are not required to submit. This objection betrays a shallow perspective on submission. In fact, everyone is required to voluntarily submit to someone else, thus everyone is capable of understanding subordination. In 1 Corinthians 11 Paul assumed this principle as a starting point (1 Cor. 11:2). The wife submits to her husband. The husband submits to the Lord Jesus. Jesus submits to God. In His submission to God the Father, Jesus identified with both man and woman. In submission to the Lordship of Christ, men identify with the submissive role of women. Additionally, because each is called to submit to someone else, each should treat those who submit to them with the respect that allows for their complete fulfillment. These two principles combine to perfect community and understanding. Personal fulfillment is achieved in and through submission, and everyone is equal in the requirement for obedience.

According to the Stah's Southern Baptist Convention, the wife submits to the husband just as the husband submits to Jesus.

No ambiguity here. There is no equality between men and women, women are to submit.

seespotrun2008 · Sat Oct 24, 2009 7:53 pm

And not to serve in the ministry.

CWT36 · Sat Oct 24, 2009 9:41 pm

From the article Husbands, Wives, Headship, and Submission on the Southern Baptist Convention website (emphasis mine):

http://www.sbc.net/redirect.asp?url=htt ... SEMINARIES


	Quote: "We have seen how the mother's and father's child rearing practices have an important influence on their child's sexual-identity development. The sex-role examples of the parents provide a learning situation for the child. The father's active leadership in the home and his affectionate involvement with his sons and daughters has strong impact on promoting their normal sexual identification. At the same time, the mother's positive attitude toward men and her submission to the father's leadership in the home are important for normal sexual identification in both her sons and daughters."19

Unbelievable. :no:

Frank 013 · Sat Oct 24, 2009 10:43 pm


	Quote: Johnson1010 If he were ever to show this amazing truth to our un-enlightened minds, our faces would melt off like the Nazi’s in front of the ark.

LOL!!!! I truly doubt that… however I still wonder about one simple question… what allows a person to believe (with total conviction no less) what they would normally admit impossible in every other situation? And with no supporting evidence whatsoever!

Is it “faith”?

If so they have fallen victim to the churches’ ultimate cop out… “We do not need to provide evidence… you need more faith!”

So sad...

Later

CWT36 · Sun Oct 25, 2009 5:02 am

Below is an excerpt from Baptist Faith and Message Sermon 20, The Family written by Calvin Wittman.

http://www.lifeway.com/lwc/article_main ... %2C00.html


	Quote: Over the course of the years that I have been a pastor I have had various men come to me, complaining that their wives will not submit to them. Of course, one of the first questions I ask is about how they are loving their wife. More often than not I find that women are more willing to submit to a man whom they know loves them sacrificially than they are to a man who is selfish and is primarily looking out for his own interests. That does not, however, change the fact that many Christian women have been more influenced by their culture than by their Creator. Quite frankly many Christian women are offended by the concept of submitting to their husbands because they have bought into the mindset of the culture rather than being obedient to the word of God. Read through the New Testament and you will find, over and over again, that God calls upon His daughters to submit to the leadership of their husbands. He does not say that this will always be easy, He does not say that your husband will always be right or will even have as clear of an insight into the situation as you may have. He simply calls wives to submit to their husbands, as unto the Lord.

This is not atheistic propaganda, it isn't anti-religious attack literature, this a sermon written by a pastor who sits on the Executive Committee of your esteemed Southern Baptist Convention.

Reading this crap is enough to make a decent man puke.

poettess · Sun Oct 25, 2009 8:54 am

I was reading through this post because I find it interesting but I have not said anything until now because most of my thoughts have already been eloquently and clearly spoken. I did rankle a bit at this quote from Stahrwe though, mainly because it shows such a lack of education or even willingness to engage in educational processes that I had to say something.


	Quote: It is the other way round. The stories in other cultures are perversions of the Hebrew Bible.

What data do you have that he biblical stories were written before the other stories? What about the Madonna and child imagry that existed long before Jesus was even mentioned in the New testament? (Egyptian mythos) If you are going to say something about what came before, can you please cite your sources for this assumption?

Frank 013 · Sun Oct 25, 2009 11:01 am


	Quote: Colin This is not atheistic propaganda, it isn't anti-religious attack literature, this a sermon written by a pastor who sits on the Executive Committee of your esteemed Southern Baptist Convention. Reading this crap is enough to make a decent man puke.

Agreed.


	Quote: Poettess What data do you have that he biblical stories were written before the other stories? What about the Madonna and child imagery that existed long before Jesus was even mentioned in the New Testament? (Egyptian mythos) If you are going to say something about what came before, can you please cite your sources for this assumption?

This is very true… Star is speaking from ignorance on this matter… all of the stories in the bible… especially the new testament were done before… and done better.

The early church indirectly admitted their blatant theft of other religious stories when their leaders were writing letters to each other saying that the similarities between the stories of Christianity and other (earlier) religions were a result of the devil trying to deceive the people… they were basically saying that the devil made up those other religions first to try to discredit Christianity when Jesus was finally born.

Of course this is all a load of crap… and I think that even they knew it when they came up with their excuse.

What Star is missing here is that his justifications are outrageous and unbelievable to a rational person… that is what apologetics is… apologizing for the bible being so messed up…

Unfortunately for Star, he does not seem to understand one simple fact (well one among many) which is this…

When one is forced to justify… they are already wrong.

The bible is not inherent… the stories within are myth and fable and anyone who believes otherwise does so in spite of the evidence… not because of it.

Later

johnson1010 · Sun Oct 25, 2009 11:21 am


	Quote: what allows a person to believe (with total conviction no less) what they would normally admit impossible in every other situation? And with no supporting evidence whatsoever!

it's enough to stupefy the imagination.

No man would believe his daughter if she told him that her child was immaculate conception. Yet they are more than willing to accept the virgin birth of Jesus.

They ridicule modern "prophets" and "man-gods" such as what we see with Raëlism http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ra%C3%ABlism
but have no problem accepting a fictional character from two thousand years ago.

Any religious person can look at Raëlism and see it as nonsense with hardly a glance, but they fail in assessing their own religions.

People who demand proof for everyday things, like whether or not they should use an umbrella, will swallow the garbage of the bible with a smile on their face.

Think about it. People wouldn't buy a lawn mower without proof of performance! how in hell are people basing such fundamental views of the world on religion, which not only has no proof of its own, but dismisses MASSIVE amounts of data to the contrary?

Mind numbing.

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