Bible quotes

[LanDroid]

What's your favorite?Here's one of mine.When you march up to attack a city, make its people an offer of peace. If they accept and open their gates, all the people in it shall be subject to forced labor and shall work for you. If they refuse to make peace and they engage you in battle, lay siege to that city. When the LORD your God delivers it into your hand, put to the sword all the men in it. As for the women, the children, the livestock and everything else in the city, you may take these as plunder for yourselves. And you may use the plunder the LORD your God gives you from your enemies. This is how you are to treat all the cities that are at a distance from you and do not belong to the nations nearby. However, in the cities of the nations the LORD your God is giving you as an inheritance, do not leave alive anything that breathes. - Deuteronomy 20: 10-17

[Johnny Neuron]

My personal favorite: Psalm 137:9..."Happy shall he be who takes your little ones and dashes them against the rock!" (Revised Standard Version)and of course "God is Love" 1 John 4:8Bradley

[drunkenblade]

I think my favorite is:"You must put to death every boy and all the women who have ever had sex. But do not kill the young women who have never had sex. You may keep them for yourselves."Number 31:17-18It's ok to engage in mass genocide, but for the love, don't hurt the fruit trees:"When you are attacking a town, don't chop down its fruit trees, not even if you have had the town surrounded for a long time. Fruit trees aren't your enemies, and they produce food that you can eat, so don't cut them down."Deuteronomy 20:19

[LanDroid]

Good catch, I should have continued my quote for another 2 verses. Fruit trees aren't your enemy, but everything else that breathes is! Thanks for clarifying that!

[Chris OConnor]

This thread needs to keep going. I've heard some pretty awful Bible quotes over the years, but having them all in one place is quite educational.Christians will defend their God when they quotes are presented, by saying something about them being a part of the old law. If anyone cares to explain this to me I would appreciate it. I know they are found in the OT, not the NT, but isn't this the same God? How could smashing your children against rocks be cool one day and then not the next?It seems more likely that the humans that wrote the OT did so at a time when that sort of thing was acceptable, and then when the NT came out society had changed enough where it was necessary to do away with the ugly stuff.Any Bible-literate BookTalker's want to elaborate on why we find God being a big penis in the OT, and then being kind in the NT?Chris "Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds." -- Albert Einstein"If you're not a born-again Christian, you're a failure as a human being." - Jerry Falwell"I don't see any god up here." - Yuri Alekseyevich Gagarin (the first man in space), speaking from orbit, 1961.

[Chris OConnor]

After posting my last message I ran a search for "bible atrocities" and then "new testament atrocities." The link below is a great read that I'm sure some of you will totally enjoy. I'm about 3/4 done with it right now.www.freethoughtfirefighters.org/a_wager ... t.htmCheck it out and post some comments...I'll post some clips from the above linked page that are relevant to this thread:Quote:This typical response falls well short of the mark, and attempts to "tone-down" the atrocious implications of these barbaric "Laws from God."There are several variant situations outlined in Deut. 22, and the (ridiculous) punishments varied according to the situation and whether the girl was betrothed or not. Also, the thoughts and wishes of the girl were not a consideration (more examples of biblical mores that do not, and should not, equate with modern society).A father held the absolute rights over the sexuality of his daughter; as such, when she was violated it was considered a violation (and financial loss) against him. If she was a virgin and was seduced (or RAPED) by a man who is not her fiance, the father MUST (not "should&quot marry-off the daughter to her seducer (or RAPIST). The man also had to pay the father 50 shekels of silver as compensation. This situation HAD NOTHING TO DO with whether or not the girl resisted, or tried to deceive, as Mr. Abanes implied in his statement. [see Deut. 22:28-29]If a young woman who is betrothed to one man (such as in the case of Mary and Joseph) but is caught having sex with a different man (whether it is her fault or not), then someone is going to be executed! If the act occurred within a town and she DID NOT call-out for help, then it is assumed that she wanted to have sex and both her and her lover (or rapist) are stoned to death at the city gate. If the act occurred in the countryside, she is acquitted (on the assumption that her calls for help could not be heard), but her lover (or rapist) is executed. [See Deut. 22:25-27]If a bridegroom accuses his bride (whom he expected to be a virgin) of NOT being a virgin, the girl's mother and father would have to bring the, bloodied marriage consummation sheets to the town elders to prove that she was a virgin. If they presented unbloodied sheets, that would be considered proof that she was not a virgin (which is silly) and she would be summarily executed by stoning in front of her father's home "because she committed a disgraceful act in Israel by being faithless to her father's household." [See Deut 22:13-21]Somehow I doubt there are too many "Christian women" here in the U.S. that would be willing to follow these "Laws from God" if they were ever actually told about them, that is. The problem is Christians typically don't read these passages in Sunday school and church services.Holy smokes.Quote:For example, when he says that no one except his specially privilegedpriests are supposed to touch the Ark of the Covenant, HE MEANS IT! Just look what happened to the poor cartdriver (Uzzah) who reached out to steady the Ark to keep it from falling off the cart (just trying to protect it from getting damaged); the good, loving, Yahweh (i.e., Jesus) became so angry He killed Uzzah on the spot (2 Samuel 6-7).And when Yahweh (i.e., Jesus) says that you shall "observe the Sabbath day and keep it holy" he means business! When a stranger who was minding his own business picking up sticks in the wilderness {on the Sabbath day} was discovered by the Israelites, they brought him before Moses and Aaron for this abomination, and THE LORD SAID TO MOSES, "The man shall be PUT TO DEATH; all the congregation shall STONE HIM." (Num. 15:32-36) and that is exactly what the "whole congregation" did; but not because of anything this man did to them (he was minding his own business, remember), but because that was what they were instructed to do by this loving, forgiving, kind, just, God, Yahweh (i.e., Jesus).On another page I found that the New Testament does indeed state that the Old Testament is to be upheld as the true word of God...Prov. 30:5. Every word of God is pure.2 Tim. 3:16. All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness.The law for the Jews is the Pentateuch [the first five books of the Bible.Chris "Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds." -- Albert Einstein"If you're not a born-again Christian, you're a failure as a human being." - Jerry Falwell"I don't see any god up here." - Yuri Alekseyevich Gagarin (the first man in space), speaking from orbit, 1961.Edited by: Chris OConnor  at: 10/30/02 8:59:09 am

[NaddiaAoC]

I remember having nightmares for a while as a small child after my father read this scripture to me, warning me of what would happen if we didn't obey Jehovah:And this is what will prove to be the scourge with which Jehovah will scourge all the peoples that will actually do military service against Jerusalem: There will be a rotting away of one's flesh, while one is standing upon one's feet; and one's very eyes will rot away in their sockets, and one's very tongue will rot away in one's mouth. And it must occur in that day that confusion from Jehovah will become widespread among them; and they will actually grab hold, each one of the hand of his companion, and his hand will actually come up against the hand of his companion. -Zechariah 14:12, 13."Look! I am rebuking on you account of the seed, and I will scatter dung upon your faces, the dung of your festivals; and some will actually carry you away with it." -Malachi 2:3I'm rather fond of the poetic writings of Solomon, the wise king of Israel:4:1 Behold, thou art fair, my love; behold, thou art fair;Thine eyes are as doves behind thy veil.Thy hair is as a flock of goats,That lie along the side of mount Gilead.4:2 Thy teeth are like a flock of ewes that are newly shorn,Which are come up from the washing,Whereof every one hath twins,And none is bereaved among them.4:3 Thy lips are like a thread of scarlet,And thy mouth is comely.Thy temples are like a piece of a pomegranateBehind thy veil.4:4 Thy neck is like the tower of David builded for an armory,Whereon there hang a thousand bucklers,All the shields of the mighty men.4:5 Thy two breasts are like two fawnsThat are twins of a roe,Which feed among the lilies.4:6 Until the day be cool, and the shadows flee away,I will get me to the mountain of myrrh,And to the hill of frankincense.4:7 Thou art all fair, my love;And there is no spot in thee.4:8 Come with me from Lebanon, my bride,With me from Lebanon:Look from the top of Amana,From the top of Senir and Hermon,From the lions' dens,From the mountains of the leopards.4:9 Thou hast ravished my heart, my sister, my bride;Thou hast ravished my heart with one of thine eyes,With one chain of thy neck.4:10 How fair is thy love, my sister, my bride!How much better is thy love than wine!And the fragrance of thine oils than all manner of spices!4:11 Thy lips, O my bride, drop as the honeycomb:Honey and milk are under thy tongue;And the smell of thy garments is like the smell of Lebanon.4:12 A garden shut up is my sister, my bride;A spring shut up, a fountain sealed.Wow. To be told that I have teeth like a flock of ewes, a neck like a tower, and breasts like twin fawns by my brother in God's new inspired scrolls will now become my goal in life.Cheryl

[Drunkenblade of Kay]

Since I come from this typical Christian tradition, I'll try to play God's advocate for the sake of discussion.Since mankind sinned in Adam, and indeed every man is guilty of sin, God is justified in his condemnation of humanity. It does not matter if God sanctioned murder, rape, or ripping the tags from mattresses. He is not bound by any obligation to preserve our well being or interests. Mankind is considered a failed species through our very own actions. The fact that we do not find ourselves utterly obliterated is evidence that despite our inadequacy, God places value in us.While the means and methods of the Old Testament may seem harsh and incomprehensible in the present society, we must understand them in the context of the world in which they lived. Many of the questionable details observed in the Old Testament were woven so tightly into the fabric of their time that extrication would have the result of social collapse. Given that humankind existed in an utterly depraved state and were by no means deserving of mercy, it is no surprise that God would employ his chosen people as an implement of judgement while instructing them according to the framework of social utility.However, "the story does not end here" . Humanity deserved nothing but punishment as a result of our depravity. Nonetheless, God provided a means of reconciliation for those who would accept it. God's endless and justified wrath could only be satisfied through sacrifice. Humanity is the justified sacrifice, but God allowed himself, in the form of the guiltless Jesus Christ to take our place. It is an undeserved gift, Paul calls it Grace. We need only to accept this gift in order to circumvent our deserved punishment. We call this Justification, for it renders me "just as if I had never sinned."Therefore it is clearly evident that God is truly is loving and kind, moreso than is even humanly conceivable. One must only understand the nature of God's perfect justice.----------------------I think it is easy to buy into this line of reasoning, especially considering that the "difficult" passages are so commonly swept beneath the pulpit and that disbelief is no easier pill to swallow when the golden carrot of eternal happiness is dangled before you.I've found that if a person has come to this point in their Christianity, logic is pitifully inequiped to persuade them. I think that developing a long term relationship of mutual respect and good will goes a long way, however.I've never been able to get a "true" believer to retreat past the bulwark of the free will argument. Maybe you all have suggestions. I brought this issue up on the other board in a thread called Atheists Only. That was miserably discouraging.

[Johnny Neuron]

In the system of worship I came from (Jehovah's Witnesses) "logic" was stressed as being very important to their theology. That being said they tried ever so hard to make everything "logical." Take for instance the passage in 1Chronicles chapter 21.David has sinned because Satan tempted him to number the people (in 2 Samuel 24 this event is also told but it says the LORD tempted him. Hmmmm...). Anyway, God's really upset, right. So He gives David three options as punishment to choose from. To make a long story short, David chooses three days of pestilence (which interestingly is depicted as an angel with a sword. Hmmmm...) from the LORD. In that time, 70,000 men die. God was going to kill more but he "repented" and stopped this maddening bloodshed. David sacrifices to God, all is well.When I left the JWs my brother in law (who has some rank in that religion) confronted me. I told him about all the atrocities in the Bible and used this passage as an example. Why did the people have to suffer for D -->D"> avid's sin? His response (which is mentioned as a possibility in JW publications) was "Perhaps these 70,000 were really wicked men who sided with the rebel Absalom. So their deaths were deserved." I didn't bother arguing with him, I was too upset at the time. But, you see that to make the text "logical" you have to become "illogical" in your thinking. Sure, saying that these were really wicked men who deserved to die sounds good, but it is completely illogical to make such an interpretation. For instance, consider the following:If these were really "wicked" men who sided with David's enemy son Absalom, how was this a punishment for David? Furthermore, why is such an explanation (which could have been just one verse) not given in the Bible? Isn't this explanation an addition to the text? If these men were wicked why did David say in 24:17, "Was it not I who gave command to number the people? It is I who have sinned and done very wickedly. But these sheep, what have they done? Let thy hand...be against me and against my father's house; but let not the plague be upon thy people." Did David think these men really deserved to die because they were traitors? I think not.Actually, I am astounded that an otherwise intelligent man like my brother in law and some of the writers for the JWs could even make such a ludicrous rationalization. I guess that's the kind of arguments a defense lawyer must make when their client is guilty as guilty can be. One more favorite from the OT...David commits adultury with Bath-sheba who then becomes pregnant. God kills the baby as punishment for David. What in thunder did the child do? How cruel! How silly! (BTW...JWs have mentioned that "possibly" the child was terminally ill before all this happened; he was going to die anyway and God just allowed this to happen. Another example of adding to the Bible to make it more palitable.)Bradley

[LanDroid]

Heh, you have probably seen this, LandoverBaptist.org, a site that sells products with some of these verses...