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Re: Christ in Egypt: The Virgin Isis-Mery

Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 6:12 pm
by AlSylvester
The comments by D M Murdock. Pg. 68, your book- "The Pyramid texts contained another "older version" of Osiris's death." From Budge, book of the dead, "Some of the texts misunderstood were ancient, 4500 years ago." How old actually do you feel that the story of Osiris is, which is the ancient religion of egypt.? Myself, I believe the sphinx is 10K years old. You know that Egypt never did anything without a reason. The sphinx is a marker for leo, 10 K years ago. The religion is then older than that. Why the older version above is important is the religion is confounded because it covers a long period of time. The second step of the process that the religion is based on is a hard step, because there is no explanation as to how to do. The above statement in your book, Osiris was drowned in the "Water of the Underworld" is tied to the original Story, because it describes how the matter has to be reduced to a base. I realize you don't understand this, but to me it is very important. Now, in 50 pages of your book, I can connect 50 facts to the process, and to Jesus as a man, and to the ancient process that the religion is based on. It is why my interest in your book. Also, in the first few pages of your book, you link the two eyes to the sun and moon. This is from the Creation and is where the "Waters Above" in Genesis is from. You also in describing the light of the sun, one aspect, "Perfection! This is the good of the light in Genesis. This perfection is extreemly important to know. Matter is what it is about. Matter can be perfected by the sunlight. Where you link the Pharoah to divinity, Jesus as you know is also linked to divinity. This is because they were fed the perfect Matter. This is how they were anoited. You have said, "many christos' down through the ages, all because of the same reason. Many, the alchemists though didn't believe it made you a christ or christos. Jesus did! Those around him also believed. You are absolutly right that jesus is tied to the myth. But, you also said in several places, 'To talk about the Mysteries was to be put to death,." I can reference this if you like. The alchemists were the same way. Now Jesus had an attitude, he talked about it and it so states in the Gnostics, "Jesus was killed, hung on a Tree because he burnt his bread." That means he was talking about the mysteries and so he was put to death. When you understand it, it is different than Osiris. Osiris was killed because he is about the matter that was perfected ( a natural Process). Jesus was killed for talking about something he shouldn't have. Osiris goes through the stages as a copy of the process to perfect matter. Osiris is resurrected a God which is the same as the Perfect matter. Jesus is resurrected as a copy of Osiris. What it is all about, the process was found that Perfected matter. The matter to the ancients convinced them of God in nature, and connected to the sun. This matter perfected what it touched (thier belief). This process was then turned into the religion of osiris. Later it was turned into christianity. The story itself is more rediculous than the myth, because it shows and explanins where everything comes from.

You also have linked Osiris to Sirius. The Dog star is linked to Sirius. The three stars of Orions Belt also, and are linked to the Wisdom of Sophia, and or to the Three Wise men. The wisdom or wise has to do with the knowledge of the process, the same secretive information that the Philosophers you mentioned will not talk about on the fear of death. You see, the whole problem is this. Osiris is based on something, as Sir W. Budge stated in Cleopatras Needles (Introduction). Until that is explained, there will always be misinformation and misunderstanding and arguments about what it is all about. The only good thing about all this is, the explanation and the medicine which man will have again, but it is still a maybe! Ask yourself, what would it mean to man to know all of the Truth of the past?

I don't mean in any way to be disrespectful. I could only wish for your knowledge and ability. But to me you have replaced Massey, and he is a sort of hero of mine for what he has placed in books. Your the present Day Massey, if that is O k to say!

Al

Re: Christ in Egypt: The Virgin Isis-Mery

Posted: Thu Sep 15, 2011 7:57 am
by ThothsKat
I am just an ordinary freethinking member of the public who out of shear interest has spent most of her life trying to seek out the truth. For 12 years i was a baptised member of a Judeo Christian sect but it wasn't until in latter years, i read the late Zecharia Stchin's books, concerning the Ancient Astronaut theory. After that i felt 'awakened' to the truth as it made everything i had read in the Old and New Testament 'come to life' (it made total sense out of an otherwise bizarre set of stories. I totally 'get it' that the Virgin mother Mary is modelled upon ISIS-MERY. I totally get it that Jesus is based upon the story of HORUS. All stories, all loosely based upon older stories. However, going back much further in time to the days of Ancient Sumer, if the Ancient Astronaut theory is true and i believe that it is, then there were such things as DNA Cloning (you might call that 'a resurrection') and more importantly with reference to THIS topic 'Surrogate' mothers (you might call them 'Virgin mothers') way back, thousands of years ago. So although i totally get the whole 'Jesus is Egypt' thing, this still does not prove that Virgin birth is/was impossible, we know today that it is a fact.

Re: Christ in Egypt: The Virgin Isis-Mery

Posted: Thu Sep 15, 2011 8:47 am
by Robert Tulip
Hi ThothsKat (Bast?), welcome, and thanks for joining the conversation.

Unfortunately, Sitchin has a reputation as being quite wacky. His ideas may be attractive as science myth, but not as science fact.

What we are doing here is subjecting all forms of fantasy to stringent analysis. A range of people have come along with various 'new mythologies', and I fear that Mr. Sitchin is another in this line. Where I find DM Murdock's analysis immensely valuable is that it is actually very difficult to find errors in her work, because she adheres strongly to rigorous scientific method. So all this prompts lively debate with other readings of Egyptian sources that conflict with science.

I hope you don't find my comments too harsh, as I would welcome it if you can defend your views in a convincing way. But if you wish to say that Murdock makes mistakes in her understanding of ancient Egypt, please be specific, and please try to illustrate your argument with evidence.

As to virgin birth, there is no way a male, who has a Y chromosome, can exist without a human father, so the Jesus story is just absurd. The story is allegory. Our discussion here has focused on what the allegory represents. The daily birth of the sun from the purity of night and dawn is a universal natural motif that readily lends itself to elaboration as myth. It is a simpler explanation than Sitchin's fanciful theories about aliens, which conflict with scientific evidence at numerous obvious points.

Re: Christ in Egypt: The Virgin Isis-Mery

Posted: Thu Sep 15, 2011 9:49 am
by ThothsKat
Mr Tulip, I don't possess any degrees in any kind of world literature, i'm just a freethinking mom. I totally get it, that Jesus is based upon the STORY of HORUS - as i said! You say - 'there is no way a male who has a Y chromosome, can exist without a human father, so the Jesus story is absurd.' Ok - who said the Jesus story was true? I didn't, it's a story based upon another story 'that of HORUS.' Yes, totally get that (unless of course Jesus/Horus was a hermaphrodite). But fanciful stories about Aliens? No way! That's one you'll have to converse with the military/government about. I recommend, just for a snack, before meatier evidence, that you take time out to watch: Out of the Blue - Military Disclosure Has Begun - National Press Club LIVE, Washington D_C, before you post me back your next comment. Or is it the book sales you're more worried about?

Re: Christ in Egypt: The Virgin Isis-Mery

Posted: Sat Sep 17, 2011 2:56 am
by Robert Tulip
ThothsKat wrote:who said the Jesus story was true? I didn't, it's a story based upon another story 'that of HORUS.' Yes, totally get that (unless of course Jesus/Horus was a hermaphrodite).
Hi ThothsKat, thanks. I was just trying to clarify your initial comments. You said "there were such things as ... 'Surrogate' mothers (you might call them 'Virgin mothers') way back, thousands of years ago. So although i totally get the whole 'Jesus is Egypt' thing, this still does not prove that Virgin birth is/was impossible, we know today that it is a fact."

This thread is about how we explain the Bible story of the virgin birth of Jesus Christ. So, if you say "we know today that [virgin birth] is a fact" it is reasonable to ask if you are saying Jesus may have been born of a virgin.
But fanciful stories about Aliens? No way!
But you sing the praises of Sitchin, whose whole 'theory' is based on aliens. You said his "Ancient Astronaut theory ... made total sense."

Sorry if I am having trouble following your line of thought.

Re: Christ in Egypt: The Virgin Isis-Mery

Posted: Sat Sep 17, 2011 10:36 am
by FTL99
For what it's worth, here's an article by Acharya S debunking Z. Sitchin.

Who are the Anunnaki?

From Acharya's FAQ's: Does Acharya subscribe to the ancient astronaut theory?

Re: Christ in Egypt: The Virgin Isis-Mery

Posted: Sat Sep 17, 2011 8:57 pm
by Robert Tulip
Discussion on planets as gods continued at http://www.booktalk.org/post96015.html#p96015

Re: Christ in Egypt: The Virgin Isis-Mery

Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2011 11:03 am
by Native
Nut/Neith/Hathor Comparisons

From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hathor

Hathor had a complex relationship with Ra, in one myth she is his eye and considered his daughter but later, when Ra assumes the role of Horus with respect to Kingship, she is considered Ra's mother. She absorbed this role from another cow goddess 'Mht wrt' ("Great flood") who was the mother of Ra in a creation myth and carried him between her horns. As a mother she gave birth to Ra each morning on the eastern horizon and as wife she conceives through union with him each day.

Hathor, along with the goddess Nut, was associated with the Milky Way during the third millennium B.C. when, during the fall and spring equinoxes, it aligned over and touched the earth where the sun rose and fell. The four legs of the celestial cow represented Nut or Hathor could, in one account, be seen as the pillars on which the sky was supported with the stars on their bellies constituting the Milky Way on which the solar barque of Ra, representing the sun, sailed.

The Milky Way was seen as a waterway in the heavens, sailed upon by both the sun deity and the moon, leading the ancient Egyptians to describe it as The Nile in the Sky.

Another interpretation of the Milky Way was that it was the primal snake, Wadjet, the protector of Egypt who was closely associated with Hathor and other early deities among the various aspects of the great mother goddess, including Mut and Naunet.

AD: Here we have a clear Milky Way connection.


Goddess Nut http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nut_%28goddess%29

Mostly depicted in human form, Nut was also sometimes depicted in the form of a cow whose great body formed the sky and heavens, a sycamore tree, or as a giant sow, suckling many piglets (representing the stars).

A sacred symbol of Nut was the ladder, used by Osiris to enter her heavenly skies. This ladder-symbol was called “maqet” and was placed in tombs to protect the deceased, and to invoke the aid of the deity of the dead.

Nut is considered an enigma in the world of mythology because she is direct contrast to most other mythologies, which usually evolve into a sky father associated with an earth mother or Mother Nature.

Comment:

When looking at the Nut Goddess as a primordial (virgin) goddess, the enigma disappear when rightfully connecting her to the Milky Way Mytology and to the Story of Creation.

Otherwise it seem to me that comparisons between Neith and Nut - and between many other primeordial goddesses - easily can be made finding great similarities. Because they belong to the very same celestial object of the Milky Way which is closely connected to the Stories of Creation.

- It also seem to me that we have to take the astrotheological/mytological understanding a further step up to the Milky Way Sphere in order to grasp the mythological meaning of "virgin creator goddesses" in general.

Links:
http://native-science.net/MilkyWay.MotherGoddess.htm
native-science.net/Mythology.Light_Whit ... _Right.htm

Re: Christ in Egypt: The Virgin Isis-Mery

Posted: Mon Nov 07, 2011 1:21 pm
by FTL99
Native, your post is essentially a copy/paste from here, which has already been addressed.

You already have a thread here: Milky Way Myths

So, please don't try to hi-jack the threads here attempting to turn them into another of your milky way threads, as this forum is about the books. That's why this forum is called "BookTalk." It is a forum that has discussions specifically about books. Have you read Christ in Egypt?

Write a book about milky way myths and then maybe you can have your own book discussion here.

Re: Christ in Egypt: The Virgin Isis-Mery

Posted: Mon Nov 07, 2011 2:20 pm
by tat tvam asi
True.