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Why is Don Quixote such a classic?

Posted: Tue Apr 06, 2010 3:51 pm
by Robert Tulip
The wonderful thing about reading a work such as Don Quixote is that you start with some trepidation that it will be hard to read, or boring, but then find it entirely engaging and informative. In her Introduction, Edith Grossman notes that DQ has been voted the greatest novel ever. It is easy to see why. As I just mentioned in response to syrianrue's question if anyone has any recommendations for a good book that teaches people how to write better, The Adventures of Don Quixote is at the foundation of numerous modern genres of the novel, including satire, drama, social comment and comedy, and is among the most brilliant classics in its depth of characterisation, wealth of literary allusion and economy of style. The wide use of the term 'quixotic' indicates the pervasive influence of this book, and Grossman notes that it is esteemed as the great definition of the Spanish national character.

Overall, setting Cervantes in his time, Don Quixote was written in 1605 and marks a key point in the evolution of the modern mind. Like his contemporaries Galileo and Shakespeare, Cervantes seeks to be loyal to ancient institutions, on the surface at least, but interprets them with such novel genius that looking back now he appears entirely subversive of the world of the middle ages. The seventeenth century was a hinge between the middle ages and modernity. The decisive philosophical shift was the emergence of the scientific spirit, the demand that all claims about truth should be backed by evidence. The intense irony in DQ is that the Don simply takes to its extreme logical conclusion the fantastic tendencies that were present in traditional life, for example the absurd Christian beliefs in heaven and the virgin birth. By showing that 'knight errancy' is an absurd throwback, Cervantes invites us to ask what other features of our culture deserve examination against the modern criteria of rationality and observation.

Re: Why is Don Quixote such a classic?

Posted: Wed Apr 07, 2010 8:24 am
by DWill
DQ is a fun book to read, I agree, and seems to be the source of many narrative forms and conventions we have around today, such as the hero and his sidekick. But reverence for a classic shouldn't make us reluctant to point out faults, and one of these in DQ is the amount of dross in the form of the tales-within-a-tale, almost all of which are stereotyped affairs of eloquent shepherds, lovelorn noble lads, and the plight of virtuous and beautiful ladies. They are somewhat similar to Shakespeare comedies but much less fun. These parts are emminently skippable, IMO. Cervantes ridiclued the conventions of the knight errancy stories, but he appeared to be in the thrall of these romances, which are in some ways no more believable.

I'm just getting to the Captive's Tale. From what I remember of it, it proves out a conventional, orthodox view of the Christian religion, which would be in contradiction to your view that Cervantes has a subversive agenda.

In my judgment, inventiveness is the sterling feature of DQ (leaving aside the regurgitated romances) and is the biggest reason for its popularity. It can be slapstick and silly, but Cervantes was a wily storyteller and knew how to keep the audience involved.

Re: Why is Don Quixote such a classic?

Posted: Wed Apr 07, 2010 4:11 pm
by bleachededen
I agree, DWill. I am enjoying the story much more than I had ever imagined, and it is very compelling, but there are parts that I could do without. This may sound a bit more bitter than I actually feel (I found as I started writing that I have some legitimate griefs with some parts of the story), but now's as good a time as any to share.

The interpolated novels are somewhat of a drudgery to get through (although not as bad as the whaling chapters in Moby Dick, some of which I had to skip in order to make it through the whole book), and the explanations of nobility and virtue are obnoxious to me, especially because as an independent, intelligent woman, it is pretty annoying to see women depicted in the way that Cervantes' women are, and to see that beauty is their most redeeming quality, second only to virtue (which I assume is also interchangeable with chastity if they aren't married or promised to be married). If they are not beautiful, like the servant girl, Martitornes, and even Aldonza Lorenzo, the "Lady Dulcinea," they are automatically assumed to be sluts, because certainly no man worth marrying would marry an ugly girl who has to work for a living instead of being sheltered in her parents' manor sighing and being virtuous and useless until some man comes to marry her. Even Sancho refers to his mother as a whore, and Don Quixote's niece and housekeeper are given about half a brain to split between the two of them.

The fact that Dorotea is said to be "clever" and "quick" does not keep her from groveling at the feet of the man who wronged her, forgiving in an instant he who took her chastity and then drove her into exile because of her shame. If a man had done that to me, I'd castrate him or kill him before begging him to keep the promises he made in order to get into my panties, and certainly wouldn't want to marry and spend the rest of my life with him. Cervantes' claims he was moved by her pleas and the state in which she had come to be because of him and repented and swore to do right by her, but I can't help but think that as soon as they're married and out of sight of their current companions he'll do the same to some other young maiden, leaving Dorotea even more shamed and starting the cycle anew with someone else. I'm sorry, but I just can't see such a philanderer changing his tune just because of some tears. He purposefully married his friend's betrothed, for crying out loud, and almost killed her when he found out that she loved Cardenio, which he obviously already knew because Cardenio had told him as much, but he had to have her because he's a spoiled bastard who gets what he wants and disregards the consequences (as of yet, no punishment has come upon him for any of the sins he has committed, and yet he is now seen in as amiable a light as Cardenio).

I also hate the way everyone is so quick to cry. I mean, really? They read a novel, everyone (including the men) cries. They hear the adventures of some wayward man or woman and find they are "unfortunate," everyone cries. Something happy happens, everyone cries. I'm going to cry if I have to read one more person's sob story and hear how everyone who heard was "moved to tears at the beauty and truth of the unfortunate [insert person's name here]'s troubles, and everyone vowed to do whatever they could to set them back in their rightful place in the world." Did people really cry this much in the 17th century? Or, more likely, is this a common device used in romances and chivalric literature which I am now positive I will never, ever read?

Otherwise, I'm looking forward to see what happens next, and how the plot to cure Don Quixote plays out. I am also curious to see when Aldonza comes in, because I know she has to play a large role somewhere, or she would not have been made one of the main characters in the musical Man of La Mancha. I realize that play isn't completely true to the book, but I can't imagine they used stories that weren't fairly pivotal to the novel's plot. I'm assuming we'll see her in Part II, but I can only guess. I'll keep on plowing through, sighs and crying and all. :-P

Re: Why is Don Quixote such a classic?

Posted: Wed Apr 07, 2010 9:53 pm
by DWill
Bravissimo! I commend you for reading so closely the "Tale of Foolish Curiosity." It's not easy to stick with it throughout its length. Did you notice that at one point the narrator gushes how great it is that the manuscript contains not only the adventures of DQ, but all the wonderful stories people within it tell as well? Cervantes giving himself a plug. Another time he has a character say that the Don is so crazy that no author could be genius enough to capture his qualities--another pat on his own back. But in any event, all you say about the sentimental conventions of the day and the subservience of women are true. For me, this serves to underscore how much Don Quixote doesn't seek to be anything but a comedic, mildly satiric book of adventures. It isn't social or religioius criticism. It isn't necessarily simple in its narrative format, though--actually a little dizzying--and that is where it achieves some depth.

Re: Why is Don Quixote such a classic?

Posted: Wed Apr 07, 2010 10:42 pm
by bleachededen
I was actually somewhat interested in the "Tale of Foolish Curiosity" until I realized what its conclusion would be and then how long it took to finally get there. But there is another example of a woman who is only valued for her beauty and "virtue." I can't even imagine why Enselmo would even need to do this, especially when his friend is trying to tell him how stupid it is (don't look a gift horse in the mouth, is the proverb that comes to mind), and then goes through with it anyway. Both men are stupid, because the one doesn't know what he has and won't be satisfied until it's gone, and the other knows what will happen but complies anyway. If I were that poor girl I'd have washed my hands of both of them and become a nun.

I'm not saying that men have gotten any smarter, as I've actually seen this kind of "test" happen in my own experiences, and the outcome is usually the same as in Cervantes' story. If you love someone and you trust them and their "virtue," why test it? If you have a diamond, you don't try to cut glass with it or hammer it until it shatters, if you can tell it is pure by every other method, why press your luck? It's just stupid, and I can tell you with as much knowledge as I have of women and men, that if you were to ask a woman to do this same test, she would refuse, because women (as far as I have seen) seem to know better than to tempt a man, probably because they have been hurt before by men who get away with philandering more than women do (even now). So yes, that story held my interest but drove me crazy.

I've also never seen anyone moved by tears as much as these characters. If the technology of today had existed during Cervantes' time and the plights of hundreds, thousands, millions of people could be heard daily, even hourly, if these same characters would be as moved to compassion and pledges of undying support as they are in their own isolated century. It's so hard to think that simple tears and unfortunate stories could cause such strong emotion and commitment when we know, today, how many millions of people are suffering far worse than any person who would have access to one of us to tell us their story personally. Of course we understand that they are suffering, but we don't devote our lives to helping every person who comes to us with a sad story and a wet face. It's just ridiculous.

And I still want to see Don Fernando punished for his douchebaggery, if I'm allowed to use that word on this site (if not I'll promptly edit it). He hasn't redeemed himself, in my eyes, and I'll be pretty sore at Cerventes if something resembling justice doesn't come his way.

Re: Why is Don Quixote such a classic?

Posted: Thu Apr 08, 2010 8:01 pm
by DWill
bleachededen wrote: I've also never seen anyone moved by tears as much as these characters. If the technology of today had existed during Cervantes' time and the plights of hundreds, thousands, millions of people could be heard daily, even hourly, if these same characters would be as moved to compassion and pledges of undying support as they are in their own isolated century. It's so hard to think that simple tears and unfortunate stories could cause such strong emotion and commitment when we know, today, how many millions of people are suffering far worse than any person who would have access to one of us to tell us their story personally. Of course we understand that they are suffering, but we don't devote our lives to helping every person who comes to us with a sad story and a wet face. It's just ridiculous.
That's a tough problem to solve. We don't seem to see around us people acting as floridly sentimental as the charcters in this story, so we might wonder whether people were actually different back then, had more extreme emotions. Of course, I wouldn't know for sure one way or the other. We often hear that a particular ethnic goup has a tendency to be volatile, gloomy, or some other quality, and while most of this is likely to be plain stereotyping, maybe there could be a germ of fact. What I suspect is that we're seeing the sentimental style of popular storytelling that persists over time. Again I wouldn't know for certain, but don't Harlequin romances go in pretty heavily for telling us about the affective states of the characters? That's the key technique, they tell us rather than letting the action convey an emotional impact--probably because the story is too weak to do that! The opposite is the bare and powerful statement of emotion, such as the NT's "Jesus wept" or the many stark and unvarnished emotions of the OT characters. A while back, I reread Mary Shelley's Frankenstein. I found her technique in the book to rely too heavily on assuring us how deeply all the characters felt, how noble they were and how perfect. It tired me out.
And I still want to see Don Fernando punished for his douchebaggery, if I'm allowed to use that word on this site (if not I'll promptly edit it). He hasn't redeemed himself, in my eyes, and I'll be pretty sore at Cerventes if something resembling justice doesn't come his way.
Yeah, douchebaggery--great coinage. I still see this story as I would one of Shakespeare's comedies, where the characters get more good stuff than they may deserve in the end (as opposed to tragedies, where they get more bad than they deserve). Or maybe this story is like one of S's problem comedies.

Re: Why is Don Quixote such a classic?

Posted: Sat Apr 10, 2010 4:33 pm
by bleachededen
Oh my God, I've finally reached the second part of Don Quixote! I was beginning to think I'd never get there. Now we'll see what Cervantes does with the story of Don Quixote ten years after he wrote the story of his first two sallies. This had better be good. ;)

Re: Why is Don Quixote such a classic?

Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2010 9:39 am
by WildCityWoman
I'm wondering if the 'weeping' is written into it because of the 'demands of the day'.

Maybe it's part of that 'morality' thing that had to be in plays . . . maybe the same thing applied to books.

Re: Why is Don Quixote such a classic?

Posted: Fri Apr 23, 2010 10:15 am
by Randy Kadish
Let's not forget that one of the reasons DQ is such a classic is that its main theme is so universal: making peace with a world we can't understand or accept.

Who hasn't struggled to do so? I know I have. And so did Hamlet.

Randy

Re: Why is Don Quixote such a classic?

Posted: Fri Apr 23, 2010 1:47 pm
by bleachededen
I am growing ever more tired of this book. I can't wait to finally finish it and read something else.

I appreciate what I have learned from it so far, and its influence on all other writing, but it's now become so repetitive and tedious that if it weren't for Grossman's very readable translation, I'd have given up by now. I'm mostly finishing it now out of stubbornness, but I am no longer enjoying any of it, and find myself getting angry at almost all of the characters and their actions and want to shake some damn sense into them.

Don Quixote's mistreating of Sancho is making me angry, because poor Sancho is his most loyal follower and the only one who isn't trying to trick him in some way for his own amusement, and yet every time Sancho opens his mouth, Don Quixote insults him and calls him names and I just want to slap the knight with an iron glove and tell him to stow it.

Sancho really needs to lean to keep his mouth shut, to avoid insults and to learn that he knows nothing about anything, and although I don't agree with the Don's insults and treatment of Sancho, I, too, am getting quite sick of proverbs, especially when they have to be explained to me in a footnote because the translation from Spanish to English wasn't perfect.

I hate the duke and duchess, and the priest and Sanson Carrasco and everyone else who use Quixote's madness for their own pleasure. I don't understand why they don't just cart him off to an asylum or a jail, where he clearly belongs, but instead play with him as if he were a toy. It's painful to read and angers me because these are supposedly "good people," who are well born and well educated and whatnot, and yet they have no idea how to treat others. We don't go around indulging schizophrenic's delusions for our own amusement, and anyone who did would not be looked upon favorably, as they are in Don Quixote's world.

I think I'm just not feeling the true differences between the modern age and Cervantes' time, and that he is probably commenting on the behavior I have just mentioned, showing that people are people and treacherous and mean, high born or low born alike. I just want Don Quixote to snap out of it or die already, because I'm really sick of his antics, and the layered narration Cervantes uses to get himself into his novel (I'm really sick of being reminded that Cide Hamete found and translated the manuscript I am reading, and the praise he often gives to the writing style -- that's right, Cervantes, keep patting yourself on the back, you're so awesome, go on, go on).

I can't wait to read something with spaceships and jokes I can actually understand without footnotes.

When will it end? :(