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Posted: Mon Jan 22, 2007 10:01 am
by Mr. P
I just want to say that, although I am very agressive sometimes, that I respect Niall and Dissident and their contributions here. I feel they are honest about what they feel yet not overly POMPOUS about it. Strong and opinionated yes, but I see nothing wrong with that.St. Gas, although he may also disagree with my tactics, is also someone I respect.I am a frustrated person and I know I need to tone down a bit...but this is how I grew up. I do try, but unabashed 'holier than thou' attitudes piss me off...and I will not hesitate to call the bastards out, theist or atheist alike.As for making an attempt to learn what others say I (and others) are 'missing' in our understanding of religion, I tried looking over some theology books at the bookstore...trying to make some initial effort...but reading the blurbs about how MORE logical it is to believe in god than not...I tell ya, I was slamming books back onto the shelf and growling! lolI will be reading the Ehrman book in the future. It looks good.Mr. P. Mr. P's place. I warned you!!!Mr. P's Bookshelf.I'm not saying it's usual for people to do those things but I(with the permission of God) have raised a dog from the dead and healed many people from all sorts of ailments. - AsanaThe one thing of which I am positive is that there is much of which to be negative - Mr. P.The pain in hell has two sides. The kind you can touch with your hand; the kind you can feel in your heart...Scorsese's "Mean Streets"I came to kick ass and chew Bubble Gum...and I am all out of Bubble Gum - They Live, Roddy PiperEdited by: misterpessimistic  at: 1/22/07 10:27 am

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Posted: Mon Jan 22, 2007 12:58 pm
by Dissident Heart
Chris: Dissident, I find myself having to skim over your posts or else fall asleep.Slumber works for you Chris...at least where Religion is concerned. It helps you avoid learning anything about the subject.

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Posted: Mon Jan 22, 2007 1:18 pm
by irishrosem
And useless, hippy, toking, hug-the-world, mile-long sermons work for you DH. It helps you avoid saying anything concrete or significant.

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Posted: Mon Jan 22, 2007 1:30 pm
by Dissident Heart
irish: And useless, hippy, toking, hug-the-world, mile-long sermons work for you DH. It helps you avoid saying anything concrete or significant.I don't toke, wear my hair fairly conservatively, and think my sermons are actually quite short. But, imagine that, discussing religion and, whaddaya know, sermons sometimes show up! Perhaps if you exhibited any sign of attending, studying, reading, discussing the subject you might have expected that.Frankly irish, you've already admitted that this is a subject you're not interested in studying: but are passionate in deriding. This is the epitome of prejudice. Is that concrete enough?

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Posted: Mon Jan 22, 2007 1:32 pm
by Mr. P
Come on guys...leave the angst to me. I accept my role and quite frankly, I resent anyone else getting bitchy around here.Mr. P. I'm not saying it's usual for people to do those things but I(with the permission of God) have raised a dog from the dead and healed many people from all sorts of ailments. - Asana Boditharta (former booktalk troll)The one thing of which I am positive is that there is much of which to be negative - Mr. P.What is all this shit about Angels? Have you heard this? 3 out of 4 people believe in Angels. Are you F****** STUPID? Has everybody lost their mind? - George CarlinI came to kick ass and chew Bubble Gum...and I am all out of Bubble Gum - They Live, Roddy Piper

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Posted: Mon Jan 22, 2007 1:39 pm
by Chris OConnor
LOL That last one had me laughing pretty hard.I'm going to shift my focus to the chapter threads now.

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Posted: Mon Jan 22, 2007 7:45 pm
by Mr. P
Dissident:Quote:When you demand that all religion be kept out of the public square then you are thrusting values upon me.This is utter bullshit. This is the total bullshit that we have rejected. Absence of religion in the legal public square has othing to do with thrusting anything on anyone. You are still free to pursue your religious values. However, litigating ANY religious doctrine is THRUSTING your beliefs on me. And by 'your' & 'me' I hope you take my meaning. This country is a plurality and was set up to be devoid of religious favoritism to any one religion. No one set of religious anything should be included in the laws for all. The best way to do this is to leave religion out of consideration when forming laws for all.Period.Now there are values that the religious SHARE with the non, and we should focus on those values. There are also values of religion (Holy War, proselytizing and ostracizing) that we should steer away from.I will get to the rest later.Mr. P I'm not saying it's usual for people to do those things but I(with the permission of God) have raised a dog from the dead and healed many people from all sorts of ailments. - Asana Boditharta (former booktalk troll)The one thing of which I am positive is that there is much of which to be negative - Mr. P.What is all this shit about Angels? Have you heard this? 3 out of 4 people believe in Angels. Are you F****** STUPID? Has everybody lost their mind? - George CarlinI came to kick ass and chew Bubble Gum...and I am all out of Bubble Gum - They Live, Roddy Piper

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Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2007 12:19 am
by irishrosem
D.H.: Nor should it be an irishroseocracy either, even though you may already live in one.Egads, D.H.! After some of your random, wandering posts I've slogged through on this forum, I find it comical and a bit alarming that you think I live in my own world. But yes, I'm sure, I'm the one that is not in touch with reality. Your derisive term infection is taken right out of the very worst of religious history: keeping the pure, clean, and othodox beliefs safe from the heretical, filthy, and impure heathen...you really should 'fess up to just who's shoulders you are standing on.I have no idea what your random collection of words mean here, except to note you have a fetish for people standing on other peoples' shoulders. You've mentioned that acrobatic talent quite a few times that I've read. I'm guessing this is some sort of reference trying to place me in cahoots with religious fundies again...that's an old comparison for you.your fanatcism for sanitary secularism betrays its own delusion.It is not fanaticism. The U.S. is a secular government, built on a secular foundation with a secular document. Religious infection in that secular world has only caused problems and should be eliminated. That is not a delusion, it is truth.Fine. You gave it another five years and, then, sealed the books. Quite the adult approach. D.H. I just want to note that, despite the heated conversations we've engaged in, I haven't questioned your own spiritual journey, or whether you employed an "adult approach" to that journey. I think you often write ridiculously, but I have never called your spiritual choices ridiculous. I find that a bit too personal to meddle with, but congrats to you for having no qualms in going there.No, I just don't see how anyone can care deeply about humanity and be so narrowminded about religion...another hint about delusion I believe.Well, I am no more narrow minded about religion in choosing to not believe in a god than you are narrow minded in choosing to do so. But even if you like to think of me as such, get your head around a narrow minded person being deeply concerned about humanity, specifically social justice, because I am.Well, considering myth includes langauage, art, dance, music, lierature, poetry, dress, ritual, suffering , joy, war, burial, birthing ceremonies, morality....jeezus, quite a bit of everything that has to do with being human...As I said, religion has had vast significance. It, however, should have no significance in secular government, as I continue to maintain. And it should not be assumed that it need always have the social significance it had in the past.I think the Illiad and Oddyssey could teach our representatives a great deal about the price of hubris and the terrors of warPossibly, in the way all good literature has great lessons within. I, however, don't want Joe Lieberman citing Homer on the Senate floor.

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Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2007 12:35 am
by Chris OConnor
I think I'm in love with you, Rose. You seem to make me smile or laugh in ever single post. And I'm not smiling and laughing because you say something silly. You will make an awesome attorney.

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Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2007 8:51 am
by Niall001
Guys, you're all really interesting. Really.But you know what, I'd believe that people should show and not tell. Take a step back. Remember who you are and what reason you have for being here. This is a message board. There will be people who irk you. There will be people who don't "get" you. But there is a reason we have a PM system. These type of conversations are better reserved for a private section because that way, there's no gallery, less chance that one individual will feel the need to counter-attack and a better chance that everybody else can discuss the matter.There have been loads of posts over the last few days, and I haven't got a chance to read them all. Alas, many of the posts seem to be attacks and counter-attacks, and of course people defending each-other and saying nice things as well.But none of these posts are really all that relevant to the thread topic.Just breath already. It's only a message board. You're here for the fun of it, not to have an unpleasant catfight with somebody you'll never meet. Full of Porn*http://plainofpillars.blogspot.com