Two Years Later, Iraq War Drains Military

Loricat · Posted: Tue May 03, 2005 12:20 pm Post subject: Re: Anybody heard about this?

So now it's the fault of the civilians (those without guns) that they were shot at instead of just merely threatened with the guns? An Italian journalist, in a war zone, at night (wasn't it?), probably nervous as hell, wanting to get to somewhere safe, was driving at what appears to be a normal Italian speed. Was there a posted speed limit: "US Soldiers will only shoot if you are traveling over 60 km/hour".

This 'blame the victim' crap, and other USA government/military policies is why things like the American Tourist Apology T-shirt exist. It's not making many friends around the world...

Lori

"All beings are the owners of their deeds, the heirs to their deeds."

wwdimmitt · Posted: Tue May 03, 2005 12:33 pm Post subject: Re: Anybody heard about this?

Yes, I have followed this story since it happened.

A tragic result, but it seems like it was pretty predictable. It is amazing how arrogant and "bullet proof" many of the ex-military security specialists (mercenaries) are in Iraq.

It seems that the motivation for failing to communicate and coordinate with the US military authorities was that Italy was paying a quite large sum to secure the freedom of the woman journalist. I have heard $10 Million.

The Italians knew this would cause trouble with US authorities, so they tried to carry out the operation in secret, and the result is a dead mercenary, and a wounded journalist.

And more bad feelings in the world against US military authorities trying to make Iraq secure.

What an absolute mess.

WW

pctacitus · Posted: Tue May 03, 2005 1:00 pm Post subject: Re: Anybody heard about this?

Lori,

She wasn't driving. As one blogger has put it,
"The Italian position... has changed. Now instead of arguing that the Americans wanted to kill Sgrena for some kind of secrecy -- but then inexplicably allowed her to get medical attention once wounded -- they now claim that the checkpoint wasn't marked well enough for their driver to identify it. Going 60 MPH on a darkened road that had been widely identified as a terrorist trap, towards the airport that the Italians knew to be highly defended by American soldiers, apparently fits within Italian security parameters.

"Sgrena lied, and the driver and Calipari should have known better than to try to speed their way into a fortified airport access. With the attacks on American soldiers taking place by terrorists with vehicle-borne improvised explosive devices, military personnel with any experience and competence should understand the foolishness of approaching any checkpoint at a mile a minute, and should damned well be looking out for any security barriers, especially on a highway that contentious."

…[T]o ignore the classics is ultimately to weaken the very foundations of our society. - James Atlas, Book Wars: What it Takes to be Educated in America

Loricat · Posted: Tue May 03, 2005 1:27 pm Post subject: Re: Anybody heard about this?

Point taken.

There has got to be some balance between paranoia and real danger, and a little less of the 'shoot first, ask questions later' mentality. I do understand that it is a difficult war zone... but the US military machine is not blameless here.

Lori

"All beings are the owners of their deeds, the heirs to their deeds."

pctacitus · Posted: Tue May 03, 2005 1:40 pm Post subject: Re: Anybody heard about this?

Please explain what "the US military machine" is in your definition and how you feel it is to blame.

…[T]o ignore the classics is ultimately to weaken the very foundations of our society. - James Atlas, Book Wars: What it Takes to be Educated in America

scrumfish · Posted: Tue May 03, 2005 4:23 pm Post subject: Re: Anybody heard about this?

Shortly after this incident I read an account of it that has definitely colored my opinion of it. I will try to find the article, but I am not sure if I will be able to because I don't even remember on which news site I read it.

In the article Giuliana Sgrena is quoted as saying something to the effect that when the incident happened she was not paying attention but had been chatting in the back seat with the man who got killed when all of a sudden there was gunfire. I found it curious that she later claimed to be very aware of how fast the car was traveling and that she didn't see anyone trying to stop the car. If her attention was focused on the person she was talking to, it would be very likely that she wouldn't notice what was going on in front of the car.

The article also has her mentioning that the people who escorted her out of the country told her that Americans would want to interview her before she left and they were going to attempt to get her out of the country without speaking to them. The article said that this is what she, Giuliana Sgrena, said. The articles I have read since then have her saying very different things.

I think she changed her story. She is a reporter who does thinks the war in Iraq is wrong and writes for a paper that is against Italy's participation in Iraq. I don't have time to look for the article right now, but I hope I can find it later because there's always the chance that I am remembering parts of it wrong. At this time it is my opinion that people are taking advantage of an incident that they are not blameless for and using it to their advantage in the publicity war.

Argh! Why didn't I bookmark it?


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