I shouldn't have read this. I'll stay off here until I receive my copy of the book in the mail. Maybe next weekl.

Wild City Woman: Thanks for the great Niagara Falls pics. What I always find most awesome about the falls is standing above the river (on the Canadian side) and looking down into the moving water just before it goes over the falls. The sheer power of the water, its blueness and unstoppable movement is inspiring and scary at the same time. It seems to be magnetic, pulling you toward it ....

One odd thing about Niagara Falls as a town is that the Canadian side is more heavily commercialized than the American side, although a lot of the money might be American. And strange how kitchy, tacky, even gaudy attractions and merchandise do so well there. I wonder if the falls put people in a strange mind set and it just all fits together somehow ...

Giselle,
You have described the feeling very well. It does have a "pulling" affect. That is what Oates is referring to in the novel. Some people can keep themselves from becoming a part of the water and some can't. I'm going to keep that in mind as I'm getting to know the characters and see how it affects each of them. I hope you'll share your thoughts on this as we continue.

I look forward to reading Oates ... Amazon says my book is on the way but I expect it will be a week yet. I suspect the 'pulling effect' of the river above the falls comes from an optical illusion that the entire horizon is moving. As you stand and look out over the water at a low angle, the water is so wide and moving inexorably, as if the horizon itself is moving. We automatically use the horizon as a way to establish where we are, so this apparent 'moving horizon' makes you want to move with it, which of course means that you feel drawn into the river and over the falls. Anyway, that's my theory, I'll be interested to read Oates take on it.

I wonder if it would be possible to establish a timeline for when things can be discussed so that we don't give away plot elements?

For example, say for the first month of August, only Niagra Falls or the author and her other works can be discussed.

September 1-10, the first sixty pages, but nothing beyond that
September 11-20, the next sixty pages, etc.

That way, we can feel free to discuss the book as we go through it, but there are no dead give aways that ruin the book's plot elements before peoples' orders have even arrived.

Just a suggestion....

Dan

I've been to the falls but it was about 30 years ago and I really don't remember much other than the falls. I don't remember whether the American side of the falls was a commercial, industrial or tourist area. All I remember is the water.

Watching the water flowing over the falls was truly a breathtaking experience. People use "magnetic" as a way to describe how the falls makes you feel as you watch the water cascading over the side and I have to agree. I felt like I was being pulled over the falls just by virtue of being so close to the rush of water. It was a strange feeling. Like a magnet or even a vacuum sucking me towards the edge.

I remember looking around and making sure nobody looked dangerous in my immediate vicinity. How easy it would be to grab someone and toss them over the railing into the river. They would have no chance of stopping the inevitable. Scary stuff. At least it was for me as a 12-year old boy.

I highly recommend you make seeing Niagara Falls a life goal.

So why do people chose suicide by falls!? You would think that there are easier and less horrific ways to end your life. I mean...you are NOT going to die immediately with a Niagara Falls suicide. You're going to get sucked into that powerful torrent and pushed down and down and down till at the bottom you get slammed under water. A suicide via Niagara Falls means plenty of time to think about what you just did to yourself. It HAS to suck.

I'm struggling to understand why the guy went from the alter to the afterlife in just a single day. What the heck happened in that honeymoon suite to make life not worth living!? Was the sex that bad? Can sex actually be that bad? In my opinion a horrible romp in the hay beats the hell out of the best trip over Niagara Falls.

It will be interesting to get a bit further into the story to see what fueled this guy to end it all. I'm not satisfied that it could have been anything that happened with his new bride. There must be more to the story and I'm excited to find out.

Well, I don't get that feeling when I stand by the falls - I think as long as you keep to the rails and know you cannot put one foot over those rails, you're safe.

But watching the water flow over is fascinating.

I imagine a suicidal person would choose to go over the falls is because death would most likely be immediate. What would get you, I suppose, is the rocks more than the actual water.

There is a book - maybe even books - on the Hill family who are famous for going over in a barrel. I read that in the late sixties. I seem to recall the idea of the rocks killing you first is detailed in that book.

There are so many books that are themed around those falls.

Yes - the Canadian side is more commercialized. A lot of Americans come over to spend money. Especially now that there are so many legal casinos.

That's something that disappoints me when I've visited in recent years. The only way you don't feel surrounded by the madness of money is to just keep your eye on the falls themselves. If you start looking around at the town behind you, all you'll see is high rise hotels and signs telling you to spend your money!

I was nervous standing next to the falls knowing there were people behind me that I didn't know or trust. It wouldn't take much to get someone over the railing and there are crazy people all over this world. The same fear applies to standing at the edge of the Grand Canyon or up on the roof of a tall building looking over the edge. Who is near me? Do they have mental problems or a grudge?

"I wonder if it would be possible to establish a timeline for when things can be discussed so that we don't give away plot elements?

For example, say for the first month of August, only Niagra Falls or the author and her other works can be discussed.

September 1-10, the first sixty pages, but nothing beyond that
September 11-20, the next sixty pages, etc.

That way, we can feel free to discuss the book as we go through it, but there are no dead give aways that ruin the book's plot elements before peoples' orders have even arrived.

Just a suggestion....

Dan"

Folks,
Dan makes a good point. Please don't discuss plot points too far ahead of the discussion. It can be very disturbing for those who don't even have the book yet. Until Sept 1 let's limit our discussion to thoughts about the physical Falls and Joyce Carol Oates.

Thank you

Linda D'Amato

I feel the same way when standing on a subway platform. You never know when some nut's going to push somebody.

At the falls, and other natural attractions, it's good to practice safety - never stand too close to the edge of anything.

I felt nervous when we visited the American side of the falls one winter. It was fascinating to look down at all that ice, and so tempting to step closer - which I didn't - ha ha!

Oh dear! Managed to borrow this book yesterday, so only on page 140. Is there a closing date for discussions? I've never been to US or Canada, so the pictures were really helpful. (Also never read Oates before) I thought Oates described beautifully the despair of a husband pushed into a marriage (I'm assuming he was gay) and a wife convinced she was an ugly old maid. I loved the bit where Dirk brought her wild flowers, and she graciously accepted them, and then the proposal. He obviously saw her real persona and determination when she had been looking for her husband; something she had hidden all her life. Can't wait to read more

heledd,
Glad you've joined us. This is no closing date for discussion. Feel free to comment as you read along.

Also, Chris has posted that Ms. Oates will answer our questions online so feel free to ask any questions you have of her through this Forum.

Enjoy

I just thought the time difference between here and there would make it impractical? When will she be online?

I believe she will be checking for questions and answer as they arise. Feel free to post one.