Joined: Apr 2010 Posts: 468 Images: 0 Highscores:3 Thanks: 25 Thanked: 29 times in 28 posts
Gender: Country:
Re: religious instruction
The only instruction religion should be giving is how to dissolve itself and become an obscure memory that even history forgets about. Its this religious instruction that has the world in the shape its in now......religion should be cut down and ground up and used for toilet paper.
Joined: Nov 2010 Posts: 798 Images: 1 Location: Maine
Thanks: 45 Thanked: 173 times in 128 posts
Gender: Country:
Re: religious instruction
]Harry Marks:
Quote:
If I have not already said I think people can do all the important moral things without religion, then I am remiss. I have no problem with that. I think it is a valuable activity, and a valuable social activity, but I am in it for the relationship I have
Behaving morally is more IMHO than just an "activity" which implies sporadic participation, rather in the way one plays bridge or tennis. Behaving morally is a life style that colors, infuses, overrides every activity, interaction with others and decisions made.
I don't understand your sentence "but I am in it for the relationship I have" What does that mean?
I agree that the Bible is (KIng James version) is written in incomparably beautiful language. In fact yesterday getting out of the car in our driveway for some reason I was quoting the 23rd psalm to my husband. However to use it as a literary reference to children or friends would mean that everyone would be equally familiar with the text and I know few people (if any) who are.
Several years ago with a couple who have been very long term friends we got into a heated discussion with the other husband, who had been raised devoutly Catholic. He thought the immaculate conception referred to the birth of Christ and his wife and I were arguing that it meant the conception of Mary. Actually most people I know, best friends etc. are completely devoid of any interest in religion, etc. I asked another dear friend the other day if any of her four children had given any of their 6 children any religions exposure, instruction and she said only one of them and that only for a brief time. These children are now mostly young adults.
Joined: May 2011 Posts: 51
Thanks: 8 Thanked: 21 times in 16 posts
Gender:
Re: religious instruction
lady of shallot wrote:
]Harry Marks:
Quote:
If I have not already said I think people can do all the important moral things without religion, then I am remiss. I have no problem with that. I think it is a valuable activity, and a valuable social activity, but I am in it for the relationship I have
Behaving morally is more IMHO than just an "activity" which implies sporadic participation, rather in the way one plays bridge or tennis. Behaving morally is a life style that colors, infuses, overrides every activity, interaction with others and decisions made.
I don't understand your sentence "but I am in it for the relationship I have" What does that mean?
I agree that the Bible is (KIng James version) is written in incomparably beautiful language. In fact yesterday getting out of the car in our driveway for some reason I was quoting the 23rd psalm to my husband. However to use it as a literary reference to children or friends would mean that everyone would be equally familiar with the text and I know few people (if any) who are.
Lady of shallot, I am sorry not to have been clear. The thing I think is a valuable activity is religion. I agree that morality is pervasive, that the things we leave undone are problems as well as the things we do that we shouldn't, for example. Like my favorite philosopher, Kierkegaard, I think that the ethical dimension of existence completely transcends the esthetic dimension, so that no amount of pleasure or money can compensate you for betraying someone, for example.
So the further point I was trying to make is that religion is a positive thing - an appropriate way of life, and there are reasons for believing society would be poorer without it. But that is not the reason I am religious. I have, as Kierkegaard would say, a relationship with the Absolute. There is an ongoing process of me engaging with an internal representation, and with social representations, of the transcendent dimension of existence. This dimension is most easily recognized as "conscience", but religious contemplation and the writings and thinking of others have led me to believe there are other important aspects of the transcendent dimension of existence. So, for example, it may matter just as much whether I have the courage to approach my parental responsibilities creatively, as whether I am compliantly obedient to the demands of conscience. Having "courage" and "spirit" requires rather more, and rather different, kinds of activities and understandings and relationships than having a clean conscience.
Joined: Apr 2010 Posts: 468 Images: 0 Highscores:3 Thanks: 25 Thanked: 29 times in 28 posts
Gender: Country:
Re: religious instruction
Harry Marks wrote:
lady of shallot wrote:
]Harry Marks:
Quote:
If I have not already said I think people can do all the important moral things without religion, then I am remiss. I have no problem with that. I think it is a valuable activity, and a valuable social activity, but I am in it for the relationship I have
Behaving morally is more IMHO than just an "activity" which implies sporadic participation, rather in the way one plays bridge or tennis. Behaving morally is a life style that colors, infuses, overrides every activity, interaction with others and decisions made.
I don't understand your sentence "but I am in it for the relationship I have" What does that mean?
I agree that the Bible is (KIng James version) is written in incomparably beautiful language. In fact yesterday getting out of the car in our driveway for some reason I was quoting the 23rd psalm to my husband. However to use it as a literary reference to children or friends would mean that everyone would be equally familiar with the text and I know few people (if any) who are.
Lady of shallot, I am sorry not to have been clear. The thing I think is a valuable activity is religion. I agree that morality is pervasive, that the things we leave undone are problems as well as the things we do that we shouldn't, for example. Like my favorite philosopher, Kierkegaard, I think that the ethical dimension of existence completely transcends the esthetic dimension, so that no amount of pleasure or money can compensate you for betraying someone, for example.
So the further point I was trying to make is that religion is a positive thing - an appropriate way of life, and there are reasons for believing society would be poorer without it. But that is not the reason I am religious. I have, as Kierkegaard would say, a relationship with the Absolute. There is an ongoing process of me engaging with an internal representation, and with social representations, of the transcendent dimension of existence. This dimension is most easily recognized as "conscience", but religious contemplation and the writings and thinking of others have led me to believe there are other important aspects of the transcendent dimension of existence. So, for example, it may matter just as much whether I have the courage to approach my parental responsibilities creatively, as whether I am compliantly obedient to the demands of conscience. Having "courage" and "spirit" requires rather more, and rather different, kinds of activities and understandings and relationships than having a clean conscience.
Quote:
So the further point I was trying to make is that religion is a positive thing - an appropriate way of life, and there are reasons for believing society would be poorer without it.
This statement shows the effect of religious brainwashing. Assuming the answer.
Quote:
I have, as Kierkegaard would say, a relationship with the Absolute.
And what relationship could you have with a non existent deity?
Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 3724 Images: 3 Location: California Highscores:1 Thanks: 349 Thanked: 749 times in 564 posts
Gender: Country:
Re: religious instruction
Quote:
Like my favorite philosopher, Kierkegaard, I think that the ethical dimension of existence completely transcends the esthetic dimension
When philosophers talk about dimensions, I stay away. It's fuzzy language that can be replaced with much more accurate verbiage. Dimension? That implies there are actual objective differences, rather than the differences being subjective, within us, with regards to ethics. As if our 'categorizations' are objective truth, rather than a subjective way to understand reality.
Joined: Apr 2010 Posts: 468 Images: 0 Highscores:3 Thanks: 25 Thanked: 29 times in 28 posts
Gender: Country:
Re: religious instruction
Harry Marks wrote:
Azrael wrote:
Quote:
I have, as Kierkegaard would say, a relationship with the Absolute.
And what relationship could you have with a non existent deity?
So, you ignore your conscience? Remind me not to sit down to dinner with you - too much risk you would stick me with the tab. Read the post.
My conscience has nothing to with it. If everyone would stop over analyzing this crap its real simple. Your all off on some third world realm that sounds like some friggin episode of Star Wars. "The Force is strong with this one." junk. All this philosophical discussion would bore the hell out of anyone reading it myself included.
Quote:
So, you ignore your conscience?
My conscience does not worry me about just stupid junk as man made religion.
Quote:
Remind me not to sit down to dinner with you - too much risk you would stick me with the tab.
Joined: May 2011 Posts: 51
Thanks: 8 Thanked: 21 times in 16 posts
Gender:
Re: religious instruction
Interbane wrote:
Quote:
Like my favorite philosopher, Kierkegaard, I think that the ethical dimension of existence completely transcends the esthetic dimension
When philosophers talk about dimensions, I stay away. It's fuzzy language that can be replaced with much more accurate verbiage. Dimension? That implies there are actual objective differences, rather than the differences being subjective, within us, with regards to ethics. As if our 'categorizations' are objective truth, rather than a subjective way to understand reality.
No need to stay away. I introduced the term dimension, not K. And he is the philosopher, not me.
So, are your ethics for sale?
Most of values and ethics are subjective, involving evaluation of the relative importance of competing principles. But there is a core of legitimate methods for deriving moral propositions, which consists mainly of reciprocity (don't do what you would object to having done to you) and honesty. But even so, subjectivity does not preclude validity. It just brings in epistemological principles different from those of science or logic.
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot post attachments in this forum
Love to talk about books but don't have time for our book discussion forums? For casual book talk join us on Facebook.
Support BookTalk.org
BookTalk.org is being upgraded to a totally new design. This upgrade is expensive. Any support would be VERY helpful! See who supports us.
Make a donation
PEOPLE PAYING FOR OUR UPGRADE:
• afv - $10 May
• LevV - $50 March
• Dexter - $10 March
• supernova38 - $25 March
• Oblivion - $20 March
• jheimlich - $20 February
• Robert Tulip - $50 February
• giselle - $50 January
Children here need worming
regularly, and I think I
need to buy more worming
tablets, so while my friends
sit on the beach, I have to
catch bush taxis up to the… more
The children have a long way
to walk to the nearest primary
school. At the moment they are
in temporary accommodation,
with volunteer teachers. There
is community land available,
a… more
The price of The 12th Disciple
has been updated to $3.99 for
Kindle readers. The book is
still available for free to
borrow for Amazon Prime
members. To be
competitive, and s… more
The 12th Disciple has been
reviewed by two different
people on Amazon. They
purchased the Kindle edition;
one in the US, one in the
UK. One review was
5-stars (US) and the oth… more
I'd like to say I've
been reading Harry Potter
since the day the world renown
series appeared on the
scene. Unfortunately,
the truth is I began reading
Harry Potter… more
Easter teaches many of us the
importance of redemption and
resurrection. Regardless of
what faith people follow, the
story of Jesus Christ has been
told in many languages in many
c… more
Our Book Talk will begin on
Wednesday, May 2nd. I look
forward to hearing about your
learning and classroom
experiences with Number Talks
as it all unfolds...
NONOPPOSITIONAL NONVIOLENCE
“The minute you conquer the
fear of death, at that moment
you are free. I submit to you
that if a man hasnÂ’t
discovered something that he
will die f… more
Yesterday, when I went to feed
Jeni the donkey, I noticed
swarms of bees entering
EbrimaÂ’s house through the
cracks in the door. We both
had a look, but he didnÂ’t
open his door… more
Whether you want to implement
number talks but are unsure of
how to begin or have
experience but want more
guidance in crafting
purposeful problems, this
dynamic multimedia resourc… more
Do you feel entitled? For
years I have listened to and,
in some instances, complained
that some people in America
feel entitled. For years I
have watched as these people
are portra… more
On Fat Tuesday and Ash
Wednesday of 2012, The 12th
Disciple was free to Kindle
users on both days. In all,
about 550 worldwide Kindle
users downloaded a copy of the
book.
‘Sacred Are the Brave’ a
collection of short stories
about the nonviolent
revolutions 1986-1989 is now
available in Kindle. Each of
the nine stories has
characters who are just
… more
The Weekend TrippersÂ’ is the
true story of Rfn Ted Taylor
and his part in the heroic
last stand in Calais May 1940.
The Weekend Trippers is based
on TedÂ’s diaries written at
the… more
Tell your friends when to meet you in the BookTalk.org Chat Room.
If you enjoy business bestsellers and would like to expand your business knowledge check out the quality book summaries offered by the world's leading book summary company.
BookTalk.org is a free book discussion group or online reading group or book club. We read and talk about both fiction and non-fiction books as a group. We host live author chats where booktalk members can interact with and interview authors. We give away free books to our members in book giveaway contests. Our booktalks are open to everybody who enjoys talking about books. Our book forums include book reviews, author interviews and book resources for readers and book lovers. Discussing books is our passion. We're a literature forum, or reading forum. Register a free book club account today! Suggest nonfiction and fiction books. Authors and publishers are welcome to advertise their books or ask for an author chat or author interview.
Tweet This Topic
