Religion and Ecological Responsibility

Dissident Heart · Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 3:51 pm Post subject:

Frank,

When you find the perfect community, free of error, without blemish or stain, the one that think exactly like you and simply get it right every time...then, by all means, work with them to do the right thing.

But for those of us who realize that the real world involves messy, ugly, broken and gross imperfections...we will do what we can to work with actual communities living real lives full of often dark pasts...doing what we can to hold them accountable, cease the abuse, seek out what's good, true and beautiful, and change direction for a better future.

The Catholic Church includes over a billion people worldwide. If you think ecological change will require an element of global interaction...then you will have to work with the Catholic Church. Your righteous indignation regarding some of its more egregious and fatal errors...is valuable and has its place- I just doubt if it will really make any difference or change any behavior...actually, again, it will almost undoubtedly work to alienate any Catholic audience.

Whereas, lifting up the voices and actions of those Catholics who follow a more Liberation Theology interpretation of the Gospel...those who practice a preferential treatment of the poor...those who practice a creation care ethic...as well as highlighting those times with the Magieterium gets it right about mindless consumerism, rampant capitalism, and violent militarism...I think this approach will be far more effective.

Here is an excellent resource for learning more about the Liberation Theology in the Catholic Church and around the world: http://www.liberationtheology.org/

And this is a superb on-line book, Getting the Poor Down From the Cross: Christology of Liberation http://servicioskoinonia.org/LibrosDigitales/LDK/EATWOTGettingThePoorD own.pdf

Frank 013 · Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 3:57 pm Post subject:

Frank 013 · Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 4:27 pm Post subject:

I would like to add this to my above point…

This current crisis was not one discovered by religion, yet the “many” religious leaders you speak of were somehow convinced that there is a problem worth doing something about.

If this is possible then why can’t this message be communicated in the same manner to their flocks?

It may be easier to convince them by using religion and dogma as the foundation (although I am not convinced of this) and if history gives us any indication of how religions will handle this problem it could ultimately be very costly if not outright disastrous.

Later

Dissident Heart · Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 5:43 pm Post subject:

Frank: So in your mind those masses of people are simply unreachable without the churches (mostly harmful) assistance? What, do they not have any life, cares or interests outside their religion? Who's seeing this thing as black and white again?

I've stated on multiple occasions that religion would be necessary, but not sufficient...meaning, by itself it won't achieve the desired impact...it will require the very best of environmental sciences making their best case for trajectories of disaster or recovery. It will also require the very best of farming and agricultural sciences to provide alternative techniques and smaller scale, more localized practices. And various economic theories will need to be experimented with and tested. Education for young and old, as well as policy making that is not driven by the demands of elite corporate interests, but by the everyday survival needs of neighborhoods and communities ecologically interconnected and environmentally dependent.

But, if you want to address the meaning of nature, what is good for individuals and society, the purpose of life and the goal of human destiny...which I believe will be crucial for the radical reorientation of individual and collective behavior this environmental crisis calls for...then you will have to talk about values, morals, ethics, justice, hope and our obligations to ourselves, our neighbors, the planet and future generations...for religious people, this is the domain of religion.

And, remember, the chasm between the secular and the sacred cuts both ways: religious people are well aware that many secularists see them as ignorant, superstitious, deluded and simply untrustworthy...a purely secular argument about radical lifestyle changes will carry very little, if any, credibility with a religious audience.

Frank: This current crisis was not one discovered by religion, yet the “many” religious leaders you speak of were somehow convinced that there is a problem worth doing something about.

I don't know how you can say that our current ecological crisis was not discovered by religion...more precisely, I don't know what you mean by that. How can you possibly determine the role of religion in the lives of the many environmentalists and ecologists across the world? Religion may not have built the microscope they use to examine toxic microbes in a watershed...but the career choice, vocational passion, willingness to tackle eco-justice issues and sacrifice the big-salaried research and development jobs...this kind of care of the earth ethos may have been influenced in countless ways by wide varieties of religious traditions and practices. One scientific trajectory involves producing chemical weapons, while another involves saving frozen tundra from overdevelopment...you don't have (nor do I) any real idea how various religions shapes either of those trajectories in any particular scientist.

And, any way, we don't need experts (be they theological or scientific) to remind us how dirty the air is, or how polluted the water is, or how much the crops are diminishing, etc...as Bob Dylan said, "You don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows."

Frank 013 · Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 7:11 pm Post subject:

DH, you write a lot but say very little…

Frank 013 · Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 8:35 pm Post subject:

You know I was going to let some of the crap in this last post slide but I am having so much fun I thought I would squeeze in a little more before I went to sleep.

Dissident Heart · Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 9:05 pm Post subject:

Frank: DH, you write a lot but say very little…

Again, Frank, feel free to move on to something else.

geo · Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 9:13 pm Post subject:

Frank 013 · Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 9:19 pm Post subject:

Dissident Heart · Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 9:26 pm Post subject:

grim: The planet is hopelessly overcrowded as it is, any humanitarian gains we are able to afford today to extend the life span and quality for desperate people has been sharply subsidized through the use of fossil fuels. Energy that is becoming increasingly costly to manufacture.

I thnk this is a very important point, and I think it requires us to consider a very important component of religious environmentalism: the spiritual practice of living simply. Simplicity, among many things, leaves a substantially reduced footprint upon the ecosystem: appetites are carefully regulated to respond to real and necessary needs...avoiding the traps of manufactured desires produced to fulfill the profit requirements of industries that do not respond to genuine taste and hunger. Consumption habits, production practices, and managing waste are fundamentally impacted by choosing to live simply. Food is grown closer to home...as are energy sources and entertainment too...a greater dependency upon neighbors and neighborhoods becomes paramount...and diet becomes largely determined by the cycle of seasons...with everything consumed finding some place in the recycling of foodstuff and life products.

Try, Simple Living http://www.simpleliving.net/main/item.asp?itemid=582

Frank 013 · Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 9:31 pm Post subject:

geo · Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 7:17 am Post subject:


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