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Reading Lists - Book Suggestions 
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Post Reading Lists - Book Suggestions
There are plenty of intelligent well-read people on this board. I think that this would be a great resource to tap into.

At present there are plenty of book recommendations on the site and that is in itself a great resource. But I think we can go further. At present people only really recommend books that they think would be suitible for the quarterly read. As such the scope for what gets reccommended is quite limited. Also as the reccommendations just get added onto a big list it is less than helpful if you wished to consult it for something specific.

I think it would be a good idea to compile reading lists on various topics. People could reccommend books that they have read on the topic and say if they thought they were good (maybe even provide a mini-review). Or if necessary, warn people away from books which weren't so good.

There are plenty of categories which we could create. Just off the top of my head, a couple of potentials:
-History
-Current Affairs & Politics
-Evolution
-Physics & Cosmology
-Religion
-Paranormalism and debunkery

If this was sucessful we could even, if required, make lists of a finer "granularity".
-Nature & Nurture
-Moral Philosophy/ Ethics
-Logic and Analytic Philosophy
and so on....


Often I think to myself - 'I would love to know more about such-and-such a subject'. ' Being able to consult somewhere like this would be great. (I would also love to reccommend some of the books that I have read).


So what do others think? Do you think this is a good idea? Is it workable?

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Edited by: Chris OConnor  at: 3/21/05 2:15 am



Thu Mar 17, 2005 6:32 pm
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Post Re: Reading Lists
I think that is an awesome idea. I especially like the idea of subtopics. I personally think an entire section should be dedicated to this. On a side note, my husband has mentioned to me that for a form that is called BookTalk, the book parts of the form are kind of hidden away.




Thu Mar 17, 2005 11:30 pm
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Post Re: Reading Lists
I like it.

Chris...I can set up the threads...I dont think separate forums are necessary...

How about putting sticky threads in a forum...Book Suggestion Forum? Acadamy? Dont want to cluster forums...how about putting separate stickys in topic relevant forums?

Mr. P.

The one thing of which I am positive is that there is much of which to be negative - Mr. P.

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Fri Mar 18, 2005 1:17 am
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Post Re: Reading Lists
Can we include "Social History" as a sub-genre? This is my favourite newish genre, full of incredibly focussed titles like "Salt: A world history" and "The history of the Screw"?

Lori

"All beings are the owners of their deeds, the heirs to their deeds."




Fri Mar 18, 2005 2:31 am
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Post Re: Reading Lists
I have "SALT" on my 'when I get more money' list!

Mr. P.

The one thing of which I am positive is that there is much of which to be negative - Mr. P.

I came to get down, I came to get down. So get out ya seat and jump around - House of Pain

HEY! Is that a ball in your court? - Mr. P

I came to kick ass and chew Bubble Gum...and I am all out of Bubble Gum - They Live, Roddy Piper




Fri Mar 18, 2005 10:27 am
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Post Re: Reading Lists
It's wonderful -- makes you look at the world in a whole different way. I'm now reading his book 1968.

Lori

"All beings are the owners of their deeds, the heirs to their deeds."




Fri Mar 18, 2005 10:57 am
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Post Re: Reading Lists
See?!? Look at what a group of book lovers will do...

Somebody organize this before we get carried away with recommendations without structure -- then we'll never be able to find book titles again!

L

"All beings are the owners of their deeds, the heirs to their deeds."




Fri Mar 18, 2005 10:59 am
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Post Re: Reading Lists
I put a temporary thread in the Roundtable. See that for more detail.

Mr. P.

The one thing of which I am positive is that there is much of which to be negative - Mr. P.

I came to get down, I came to get down. So get out ya seat and jump around - House of Pain

HEY! Is that a ball in your court? - Mr. P

I came to kick ass and chew Bubble Gum...and I am all out of Bubble Gum - They Live, Roddy Piper




Fri Mar 18, 2005 11:21 am
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Post Re: Reading Lists
CSflim

I do like your idea, but am not sure of the best way to make it a reality. Let's use this thread to discuss it further.

scrumfish

Quote:
...my husband has mentioned to me that for a forum that is called BookTalk, the book parts of the form are kind of hidden away.
Any suggestions on how to improve in this regard? What do you mean by the "book parts?" Are you specifically referring to the "BOOKS" link at the top of every page in the orange link bar?

I need specifics in order to implement a change. First we must consider that there are actually two different web site URL's for BookTalk. Almost every page is located on the booktalk.org domain, while our message board resides with EZ Board. I have freedom to do plenty with the booktalk domain, but am limited with what EZ Board permits.

What specifically can I do to make the "books parts" more apparent? If I add links or text on the forums page it will bump the forums down. This doesn't seem desirable, as visitors will see only what appears on the very top of the page. Most visitors to any web site skim the material and quickly judge whether or not they want to stick around. If the forums get bumped lower those transients will not even see the top forum as it will be too far down the page, and require scrolling to see.

So just to be sure we are on the same page, what do you mean by "book parts" Scrum? I need to know so I know how to process your suggestion.

misterpessimistic

As I said up above I love the idea, but am not sure how it can best be implemented. We have a forum called "book suggestions," but do we want to add 5 or more "sticky" topics to this forum? A sticky topic should stand out...that is the entire purpose. When you have more than 1 or 2 you loose the entire benefit of having that feature.

When people visit that forum they can easily miss new posts to non-sticky threads, as those threads will always appear deeper down the list. Imagine the most recent post appearing 8 threads down the list. This is a reality when you consider that the book suggestion thread regularly already has a handful of sticky topics by necessity.

We will always have the Permanent Book Suggestions thread stuck up top, or at least until we hire a programmer to design a database for all book suggestions. For the time being that thread must always be on top.

Then we will always have our official poll threads and nominations threads. This amounts to 3 or even 4 sticky topics. Shall we add 5 or more additional sticky topics? Maybe, but I'm not convinced this would benefit that forum.

Quote:
...how about putting separate stickys in topic relevant forums?
Since we already have a book suggestion forum it seems silly to put any book suggestions anywhere but there. I am convinced that all book suggestions should go ONLY in the book suggestions forum; otherwise this community will look like a complete mess to visitors AND members.

So the real question is



Sun Mar 20, 2005 11:46 pm
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Post Re: Reading Lists
It sounds like the main concern is that the thread entitled, "Permanent Thread - All Book Suggestions go Here," is bulky, confusing, and hard to navigate effectively. I agree.

The solution seems to be us having one large sortable database. By "sortable" I mean that there would be several fields that anyone can sort however they like.

I will soon be paying a programmer to create this database so that anyone can effectively view our database and find what they want quickly and easily.

Here is how I am envisioning the design...

Imagine a page on our site entitled, "Suggested Books." This page contains a table, with the following columns across the top...

Title
Author
Subject
Amazon.com link

If you click on "Title" it sorts the entire database of book titles alphabetically. Click it again, it sorts in reverse alphabetical order.

Click on Author it sorts the entire database by author alphabetically, and then naturally if you click it again it reverses the order.

What it seems you guys want is to be able to sort by subject. Well, we will be able to once this database is created and up and running. We will try to keep the total number of subjects to a minimum, such as "science, history, current events, etc..." Or we can get even more specific, but the goal will be for people to be able to find books quickly and efficiently, so fewer categories seems wiser.

I don't see a reason to have a bunch of sticky topic threads, when many of the books suggested will have to be suggested yet again in the permanent thread. Talk about redundant. Visitors will really think we're a mess.

I also will soon create a page that explains the whole voting process for new people. We'll be using the Acronym "SNOW."

S = Suggestions
N = Nominations
O = Options
W = Winner


(S) Suggestions

We will continually be adding to the book suggestion database that I just mentioned above. The books we suggest will NOT have to be ideal for our quarterly readings, but merely good books members suggest other members read. This is an important point. Again, this massive database will simply be a sortable database of books members suggest other members read.

I'll always reserve the right to not allow certain books into the database, as we don't want it too damn big. Heck, big is ok I suppose. If it is designed properly. We could even have categories for Humor, Art, and other off-the-wall topics.

I'd like to make it so members can enter books into the database themselves, but I'm not sure if this will be possible. I may have to do it myself.

(N) Nominations

From our database members can pick a handful of books they would like to see on any given poll. In other words, they scan the database and pick books they feel would make excellent reads for our quarterly selections.

They then make a post in the appropriate nomination thread naming the book or books they wish to nominate. All books appearing in the nomination thread must appear in the database, and if they don't they will be added. Nominations should be a subset of our database.

We could have a dozen nominated books appearing in the nomination thread, but obviously we will never have more than 5 on a poll. Ideally, each book poll contains 3 or 4 books.

(O) Options

From the nomination thread we will pick between 3 and 5 book options that will appear on the poll.

(W) Winner

One book will be announced as the winner of each poll.

So we go from suggestions to nominations to options to a winner. This is basically what we do now, but the process is confusing without a page explaining how it works for new people. And also, without having a sortable database we have to use that bulky "permanent" thread.

Chris





Mon Mar 21, 2005 3:39 am
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Post Re: Reading Lists
Oh, and there would be a link on the Forums page and on several other pages throughout the site to the Book Suggestions database. At the top of the Book Suggestions database page would be a link entitled "Suggest A Book!"

This link will take you to a page with a form for suggesting books. Here is an example of how that page might look.

Chris





Mon Mar 21, 2005 3:43 am
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Post Re: Reading Lists
Here is something I'm working on behind the scenes. Right now that page only contains our past book selections, but it will eventually contain all of the books that were suggested and deemed suitable for nomination for polls. Any book on that page will be acceptable for our quarterly readings.

That's interesting Chris. However, my problem with it is that it doesn't include a description of the book. The Book Suggestion thread is ideal in that sense. Perhaps a 'best of both worlds' is possible?

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Edited by: CSflim at: 3/23/05 8:21 pm



Wed Mar 23, 2005 4:31 pm
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Post Re: Reading Lists
I don't mind that you've moved the book discussion folders to the top, as I realize that's the focus of the site, but since I come here mostly for the category folders (eg. "Religion, Philosophy, & the Arts"), I'd like to see them in the next category down.

Also, since I now know that the Book Suggestions forum is primarily for suggesting the quarterly reads, I'd say it would be more intuitive to have it in the Book Discussion Forums category.




Wed Mar 23, 2005 4:58 pm
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Post Re: Reading Lists
I have to say that I really like the new layout. Much more suited to a place called BookTalk!

Minor suggestions: "Book Archives" could probably be placed at the end of the "Book Discussion Forums" tab, rather than getting a tab all of its own. and "The Academy" could be added either to General or Book Discussion. I say this because having tabs with a single element in them looks ugly, takes up more space than is needed, and makes things look more complex than they need to.

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Wed Mar 23, 2005 5:19 pm
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Post Re: Reading Lists
I had a thought I'm going to throw out just to make everything even more confusing. What about doing CSflim's suggestion the opposite way? If someone has a topic they are interested in reading about have a forum where he can post a thread asking for suggestions on the topic? It doesn't really cut down on confusion and it probably isn't what CS had in mind, and anyone could do that in the appropriately subjected forums, but I thought I'd mention it anyway.




Wed Mar 23, 2005 6:31 pm
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Moby Dick: or, the Whale by Herman MelvilleA Visit from the Goon Squad by Jennifer EganLost Memory of Skin: A Novel by Russell BanksThe Structure of Scientific Revolutions by Thomas S. KuhnHobbes: Leviathan by Thomas HobbesThe House of the Spirits - by Isabel AllendeArguably: Essays by Christopher HitchensThe Falls: A Novel (P.S.) by Joyce Carol OatesChrist in Egypt by D.M. MurdockThe Glass Bead Game: A Novel by Hermann HesseA Devil's Chaplain by Richard DawkinsThe Hero with a Thousand Faces by Joseph CampbellThe Brothers Karamazov by Fyodor DostoyevskyThe Adventures of Huckleberry Finn by Mark TwainThe Moral Landscape by Sam HarrisThe Decameron by Giovanni BoccaccioThe Road by Cormac McCarthyThe Grand Design by Stephen HawkingThe Evolution of God by Robert WrightThe Tin Drum by Gunter GrassGood Omens by Neil GaimanPredictably Irrational by Dan ArielyThe Wind-Up Bird Chronicle: A Novel by Haruki MurakamiALONE: Orphaned on the Ocean by Richard Logan & Tere Duperrault FassbenderDon Quixote by Miguel De CervantesMusicophilia by Oliver SacksDiary of a Madman and Other Stories by Nikolai GogolThe Passion of the Western Mind by Richard TarnasThe Left Hand of Darkness by Ursula K. Le GuinThe Genius of the Beast by Howard BloomAlice's Adventures in Wonderland by Lewis Carroll Empire of Illusion by Chris HedgesThe Sound and the Fury by William Faulkner The Extended Phenotype by Richard DawkinsSmoke and Mirrors by Neil GaimanThe Selfish Gene by Richard DawkinsWhen Good Thinking Goes Bad by Todd C. RinioloHouse of Leaves by Mark Z. DanielewskiAmerican Gods: A Novel by Neil GaimanPrimates and Philosophers by Frans de WaalThe Enormous Room by E.E. CummingsThe Picture of Dorian Gray by Oscar WildeGod Is Not Great: How Religion Poisons Everything by Christopher HitchensThe Name of the Rose by Umberto Eco Dreams From My Father by Barack Obama Paradise Lost by John Milton Bad Money by Kevin PhillipsThe Secret Garden by Frances Hodgson BurnettGodless: How an Evangelical Preacher Became One of America's Leading Atheists by Dan BarkerThe Things They Carried by Tim O'BrienThe Limits of Power by Andrew BacevichLolita by Vladimir NabokovOrlando by Virginia Woolf On Being Certain by Robert A. Burton50 reasons people give for believing in a god by Guy P. HarrisonWalden: Or, Life in the Woods by Henry David ThoreauExile and the Kingdom by Albert CamusOur Inner Ape by Frans de WaalYour Inner Fish by Neil ShubinNo Country for Old Men by Cormac McCarthyThe Age of American Unreason by Susan JacobyTen Theories of Human Nature by Leslie Stevenson & David HabermanHeart of Darkness by Joseph ConradThe Stuff of Thought by Stephen PinkerA Thousand Splendid Suns by Khaled HosseiniThe Lucifer Effect by Philip ZimbardoResponsibility and Judgment by Hannah ArendtInterventions by Noam ChomskyGodless in America by George A. RickerReligious Expression and the American Constitution by Franklyn S. HaimanDeep Economy by Phil McKibbenThe God Delusion by Richard DawkinsThe Third Chimpanzee by Jared DiamondThe Woman in the Dunes by Abe KoboEvolution vs. Creationism by Eugenie C. ScottThe Omnivore's Dilemma by Michael PollanI, Claudius by Robert GravesBreaking The Spell by Daniel C. DennettA Peace to End All Peace by David FromkinThe Time Traveler's Wife by Audrey NiffeneggerThe End of Faith by Sam HarrisEnder's Game by Orson Scott CardThe Curious Incident of the Dog in the Night-Time by Mark HaddonValue and Virtue in a Godless Universe by Erik J. WielenbergThe March by E. L DoctorowThe Ethical Brain by Michael GazzanigaFreethinkers: A History of American Secularism by Susan JacobyCollapse: How Societies Choose to Fail or Succeed by Jared DiamondThe Battle for God by Karen ArmstrongThe Future of Life by Edward O. WilsonWhat is Good? by A. C. GraylingCivilization and Its Enemies by Lee HarrisPale Blue Dot by Carl SaganHow We Believe: Science, Skepticism, and the Search for God by Michael ShermerLooking for Spinoza by Antonio DamasioLies and the Lying Liars Who Tell Them by Al FrankenThe Red Queen by Matt RidleyThe Blank Slate by Stephen PinkerUnweaving the Rainbow by Richard DawkinsAtheism: A Reader edited by S.T. JoshiGlobal Brain by Howard BloomThe Lucifer Principle by Howard BloomGuns, Germs and Steel by Jared DiamondThe Demon-Haunted World by Carl SaganBury My Heart at Wounded Knee by Dee BrownFuture Shock by Alvin Toffler

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