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The Secret Garden: Chapters 19, 20 and 21

#59: Dec. - Jan. 2009 (Fiction)
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Thomas Hood
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GentleReader9 wrote:It might just mean that this is the true referent of what is meant by forever and there is no forever apart from it to be experienced.
Profound, GR9. This aside from the author must sum up the philosophy of the book. By occasionally finding beauty in the universe as a whole, one is assured of enduring goodness in times of personal decline. Thoreau describes it this way:
There were times when I could not afford to sacrifice the bloom of the present moment to any work, whether of the head or hands. I love a broad margin to my life. Sometimes, in a summer morning, having taken my accustomed bath, I sat in my sunny doorway from sunrise till noon, rapt in a revelry, amidst the pines and hickories and sumachs, in undisturbed solitude and stillness, while the birds sang around or flitted noiseless through the house, until by the sun falling in at my west window, or the noise of some traveler's wagon on the distant highway, I was reminded of the lapse of time. I grew in those seasons like corn in the night, and they were far better than any work of the hands would have been. They were not time subtracted from my life, but so much over and above my usual allowance. I realized what the Orientals mean by contemplation and the forsaking of works."
Tom
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Tom Hood wrote:
By occasionally finding beauty in the universe as a whole, one is assured of enduring goodness in times of personal decline. Thoreau describes it this way:

Quote:
There were times when I could not afford to sacrifice the bloom of the present moment to any work, whether of the head or hands. I love a broad margin to my life. Sometimes, in a summer morning, having taken my accustomed bath, I sat in my sunny doorway from sunrise till noon, rapt in a revelry, amidst the pines and hickories and sumachs, in undisturbed solitude and stillness, while the birds sang around or flitted noiseless through the house, until by the sun falling in at my west window, or the noise of some traveler's wagon on the distant highway, I was reminded of the lapse of time. I grew in those seasons like corn in the night, and they were far better than any work of the hands would have been. They were not time subtracted from my life, but so much over and above my usual allowance. I realized what the Orientals mean by contemplation and the forsaking of works."
This is why I want to talk to you, Tom. You not only understand what I try to get across about how I read the books, you bring in intertextual and contextual stuff that enriches it and validates it or expands it with sincere, thoughtful questioning. And then you listen to the answers, too. I'm so glad you're here! :smile:
"Where can I find a man who has forgotten the words so that I can talk with him?"
-- Chuang-Tzu (c. 200 B.C.E.)
as quoted by Robert A. Burton
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Thomas Hood
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GentleReader9 wrote:You not only understand what I try to get across about how I read the books, . . .
Thank you, GR9, but to tell the truth, when I first read this book I misread the passage you quoted, because I was focused on Burnett's interest in spiritualism, which isn't relevant here. She is describing real personal experience, not religious theory, and you made me see it differently. Thanks.

Tom
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I agree that Burnett is talking about real personal experience. The now moment is a referent for forever, if I understand GR9's meaning, because it's the only moment that is independent of the incessant plod of time that we are so familiar with. Right now, a moment can stand still and forever can be lived fully in that moment. So living forever, as Colin is talking about in this quote, can be seen as happening vertically in the now moment rather than horizontally in the backward or forward march of time.
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giselle wrote: Right now, a moment can stand still and forever can be lived fully in that moment.
I think so too, giselle, and here's a personal example. In 1999 I completed a project that had worked on for decades -- with never an encouraging word -- and the day I finished I remember thinking I could lay down and die and I really wouldn't care, not that I was immortal but that I had done my bit for the universe. And I still think so, but that one completed project has opened doors to others.

Tom
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Oh goody! I get to "correct" you some more. :laugh2:

Tom said, and I paste:
I misread the passage you quoted, because I was focused on Burnett's interest in spiritualism, which isn't relevant here.
Are you sure you didn't just have an alternate reading which might have been equally valid? The cool thing about literary passages, dreams and poetry is that there are multiple correct readings. I think spiritualism is probably relevant throughout the book and I would like to know what you read, on a less personal, more symbolic level?
"Where can I find a man who has forgotten the words so that I can talk with him?"
-- Chuang-Tzu (c. 200 B.C.E.)
as quoted by Robert A. Burton
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Thomas Hood
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GentleReader9 wrote:Are you sure you didn't just have an alternate reading which might have been equally valid? The cool thing about literary passages, dreams and poetry is that there are multiple correct readings. I think spiritualism is probably relevant throughout the book and I would like to know what you read, on a less personal, more symbolic level?
Yes, I think I made a mistake in supposing the "One of the strange things about living in the world . . ." passage was spiritualistic, because nature is speaking to her and not the dead, even in memory. It's her assurance of personal immortality. There's no seance nor clear sight.
"Archie! Archie! Archie!" it said, and

again, sweeter and clearer than before, "Archie! Archie!"

He thought he sprang to his feet not even startled. It was such a real voice and it seemed so natural that he should hear it.

"Lilias! Lilias!" he answered. "Lilias! where are you?"

"In the garden," it came back like a sound from a golden flute. "In the garden!"
Although it occurs in a dream, I did consider this purple passage to be spiritualistic, because it implies that we are visited by the dead more than just in memory.
The cool thing about literary passages, dreams and poetry is that there are multiple correct readings.
Well, a teacher might say so who wants to get a response from students, and everybody has to start somewhere. I'd prefer to say that there are multiple tolerable readings, because some readings are more insightful than others, are more aware of the psychology and cultural background of the author and more sensitive to use of language. I read Walden through three times and didn't detect a single pun. But now that I have been corrected by others, my reading has improved :)
So correct me all you can.

Tom
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I think there might be a blurry line here between what is personal experience in a straightforward sense, that is, what our senses tell us is happening around us and, on the other hand, spiritual experience. What Burnett describes of Colin's experience is personal experience but could it not be his spirit prompting him to experience an eternal moment, giving him access to forever lived in that moment, a moment that would otherwise be just an average moment in time like any other?

Whether this is Burnett's meaning or not, I think spirituality is threaded throughout this book and that she intends the characters to be moved by and to experience spirituality in many different ways. The hovering presence of Mrs. Craven, for example, the way her "spirit" binds the story and the characters together is an indication of this. The characters go about their personal experiences within this spiritual context.
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I would like to think of Mrs. Craven in a "guardian angel" type of sense. She knows that her family is suffering and she is nudging them back to life. I guess you could say that it is spiritual. It was still pretty much a magical book in my opinion.
If you obey all of the rules, you miss all of the fun.
--Katherine Hepburn
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giselle wrote: What Burnett describes of Colin's experience is personal experience but could it not be his spirit prompting him to experience an eternal moment, giving him access to forever lived in that moment, a moment that would otherwise be just an average moment in time like any other?
This one I had to think about, but yes, I think everyone, religious or not, has a natural hunger for spiritual life.

Tom
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