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LanDroid 
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 Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 1:55 pm Post subject:
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Regarding the melting of the northern ice cap, you will probably be hearing from skeptics that this is all due to volcanoes under the sea.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20080625/sc_afp/sciencegeologyoceansvolcan o
However, this appears to have little effect on the ice above.
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Do explosive volcanic eruptions on the seafloor of the Arctic Ocean contribute to the melting of the Arctic ice cap?
No, not at all. The Arctic Ocean is a huge reservoir of water that can readily absorb and disperse the heat and volatile gases from the volcanic eruptions at the seafloor.
...The water in the Arctic Ocean is stratified—layered like a cake—with lighter layers lying atop denser layers of water, like oil atop water. (Colder and/or saltier seawater is denser than warmer and/or less salty seawater.) Waters in the Arctic depths remain trapped near the bottom. They do not mix much with surface waters. Almost no heat is transmitted all the way up to the underside of the ice.
http://www.whoi.edu/page.do?pid=7545&tid=282&cid=44586&ct=162#sidebar |
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shawnrohrbach
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| Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 8:45 pm Post subject:
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| dillonbrownsisland wrote: |
Interesting discussion here, I had to chime in!
First off, has anyone here read the speech that renown author Michael Crichton gave a few years back? It's titled "Aliens Cause Global Warming" and basically the speech states that until the science is perfected, we will never know whether another life form exists outside of our planet and the same goes for whether or not we will ever know what the cause of Global Warming is. Crichton has a strong stance against Global Warming, however, so you have to take the speech in with an unbiased oppinion, if possible. I agree with Crichton here, to some extent. I do believe that the earth is undergoing major climatic changes, that's undeniable. But whether or not we're doing it or the fact that it's possibly being pulled into the sun's gravitational pull further or just simply ageing, we will never know. I personally believe that political figures and celebrities have simply jumped on the band-wagon to get elected into office and have something to promote. The thing that scares me the most is the fact that Global Warming is turning into more of a scare tactic to put on the nightly news amongst the murders, wildfires and car accidents, instead of being looked at as a scientific "happening" by the common public. I understand this view may be far different than others who are discussing this topic, but I feel people in general (especially readers) are open-minded enough to hear a different belief from time to time.
To read Crichton's speech (I believe he's written a few on this topic, as well as controversial issues reguarding gene-therapy and genetic research) you can visit his official website at www.crichton-official.com |
I think along these lines as well. Even though I might not take the view of Crichton quoted here, I am skeptical that human behavior is the sole cause of the climate changes we are experiencing. As a political tool, it has become as effective as George Bush's use of "terrorism". Any thinking person could se right through his fear tactics and I am sad the Democrats have adopted the same tactics. Yes, I drive less because burning fossil fuels pollute the air. In fact I ride a bike typically 100 miles a week for this reason (and I look better naked) but there are natural cycles that are not human caused that have as much to do with global climate changes. I appreciate this thread has ut the brakes on the argument a bit and taken a realistic view. |
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Grim
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| Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 12:54 pm Post subject:
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You think climate change is a serious problem, don't even mention peak oil and we could possibly cope with the seriousness of the problem.
Global warming is analogus to terraforming of the planet to man's needs. In a sense we have evolved to the point where I would argue that we are no longer a part of a natural earth system. This is possible due to our reliance and utilization of high-energy compounds, all practical forms of which are non-renewable, and the vast majority of which become invisible compunds in the air which cause the global warming or the greenhouse effect.
Earth follows imperfectly cyclical trends in all aspects, including ambient temperature. We are disrupting a balance that has been established billions of years ago.
The melting of arctic sea ice ironically opens the area to extended human exploitation.
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2008/07/24/national/w 050239D60.DTL
http://www.athensnews.com/opinion/commentary/2008/may/29/commentary-pe rception-vast-arctic-oil-supplies-cou/
One of the most of the most insidious effect of fossil fuel use has been the over-population of the planet, stressing earth's natural carrying capacity to the point where we are all in a sense living beyond our means. Nothing we do in our daily lives is not in some way seriously detrimental to the earth and/or other peoples and animals/organisms depending on it.
http://dieoff.org/page112.htm
My recommendation: hope you are not the 5 of 6 extra people that the earth will soon not be able to provide for sustainably (or with the use of greenhouse gaseous emission), live renewably by your own means. Urban centers where people are concentrated will be the most effected by resource and luxury shortages. |
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Ophelia
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| Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 1:34 pm Post subject:
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Look at your photos, apply a little high school student's logic and you can get what a colleague of mine read last week:
"Global warming is the consequence of the rise in sea level." |
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Grim
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| Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 1:38 pm Post subject:
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| Ophelia wrote: |
Look at your photos, apply a little high school student's logic and you can get what a colleague of mine read last week:
"Global warming is the consequence of the rise in sea level." |
Meaning? |
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Ophelia
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| Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 1:41 pm Post subject:
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| Quote: |
Ophelia wrote:
Look at your photos, apply a little high school student's logic and you can get what a colleague of mine read last week:
"Global warming is the consequence of the rise in sea level."
Meaning? |
The student's meaning? He thinks the sea rose, thus causing the climate to get warmer.  |
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ZachSylvanus
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| Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 1:59 pm Post subject:
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I apologize for posting this again, but I"m copying it from my other account onto my original one!
There are several good books on the topic (listed at the end of the lecture presented here: http://changingclimates.colostate.edu/pastEvents/colloquium08.html). Climate data and other evidence really does point to there being an anthropogenic reason behind climate change, and it really does look like it's due to human CO2 primarily.
That's not to say other factors don't impact it, but that the driving cause seems to be from industry and other emissions. |
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