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stcamp
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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 10:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Hi,

I would say Poland was where we were asked the most.

We stayed for 2 weeks in an Apt in Paris. I think perhaps twice. I remember it was asked with a smile. As in "how could we not like it."

Ireland, probably as frequently, perhaps more so, than Poland.

Germany. Never, that I can recall.

Japan. Probably the closest to how an American would ask.

Regards,
Steve
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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 10:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Quote:
I would say Poland was where we were asked the most.

We stayed for 2 weeks in an Apt in Paris. I think perhaps twice. I remember it was asked with a smile. As in "how could we not like it."

Ireland, probably as frequently, perhaps more so, than Poland.

Germany. Never, that I can recall.

Japan. Probably the closest to how an American would ask.


Thanks, this is fascinating!

Perhaps I misjudged my American questioners then.
The thing is I always felt they meant well, and I really would have liked to give an answer they liked!

What did the European questioners ask? "Do you like it here"? or "What do you like most?"

In a touristy place and if it is clear the person is a tourist I don't think one can conclude much from the question though.
In my case the askers knew I was not a tourist.


And Japan: amazing!!


Germany: I'm not surprised (but I would have sworn it wouldn't happen in France either).

In countries like France and Italy, where you see so many tourists and the culture and food are praised, you just know that you are a celebrated culture.
Here is how I would sum up my observations about Germans. They know that they don't have the food and places like Venice or Paris, and they're content to have their neighbours having them, and will let the French and the Italians brag if they feel like it.
For historical reasons (or also because they don't feel like bragging) the Germans will not tell you that their country is best or ask questions that invite praise but deep-down they are every bit as convinced that they have it best-- if they voice this it must be among themselves though.

Now about Japan and Poland-- countries where I haven't been.
Do you have an idea what answers people expected?
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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 11:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Hi,

Poland. I think they wanted us to rate it. Yet tell them we liked it. They would then start talking about the problems with the infrastructure and the changes that were happening.

Ireland. Ireland has a large population that has been to America and is used to Americans. We stayed in a house in an Irish neighborhood. People were more likely to ask "whats up in the States."

Japan. Somewhat American in that they really wanted to be approved of and at the same time were somewhat disdainful of America.

France. We had a apt. in the Palais Royale and would visit the same market, resturant, etc. Afterwhile, despite my bumbling attemps to speak French they would ask how we liked it. It was more a lead in so they could tell us they liked America and where they had visited. I remember a waiter telling us he would bring us more ice because he knew from his time in America that lots of ice was the way to serve Cocola.

It may be somewhat different for me. I usually try to speak a few words in the language, learn basic customs, and we are somewhat skinny people. I remember a women in France telling me how in America all the young boys (age 13-1Cool look alike. Oh, I don't wear a ballcap or T-shirt with printing on it or running shoes.

I got into a long conversation in Normandy that ended up being about French agricultural practices in the 70's and changes since because I started asking about hedgerows.

regards,

Steve
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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 12:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I thought at the time that one of the things that made understanding a little difficult with the "What do you like best?" question was that I felt people were divided into either Americans or "immigrant", there wasn't a slot for "European on a one-year exchange programme", even if I told people that this was what I was.

People were used to meeting a lot of immigrants, and of course I understood that if you had suffered from hunger or came from an underdeveloped country you would marvel at huge supermarkets and airplanes, but my perspective was different.
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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 1:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Possibly. I am probably not a good person to answer this. I live surrounded by emmigrants. I live outside Washington DC in a county where at least 30% came from faraway places. My daughters school system says there is over 100 languages spoken in the system.

I never thought when I asked or was asked that it was about technology. It has been awhile since America was that advanced. Europe dug out of the ruins years ago. Most Asian cities are huge. Maybe if you are from Mexico or Central America it might be different enough to comment on.

I work with 1 French man, 1 Spanish women, and 1 Italian. Oh, and 1 Mexican. The rest are 3rd or 4th generation American probably. San Diego has a huge military population with most having done duty overseas.

I think you may have misread what was meant. Also, I think part of it was people wanted to make sure you had not been slighted or had a bad time. Americans like to talk and usually are very generous. I told a German not to long ago that it is OK to ask an American anything except how much money they make.

regards,

Steve
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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 2:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Quote:
it is OK to ask an American anything except how much money they make.


There goes another of my illusions!


I would have thought Americans would have been pleased to tell you how much they have!!!

One thing I learnt when I was a teenager is that in France, you never, ever asked people how much they earn. There was a laughable side to it, because it was not a question I would have been tempted to ask.

I lived in a street where all the houses had been built at the same time. They were not exactly identical, but you could see that they were middle class, and people had jobs that paid more or less the same.

I worked out from what my parents said was that in fact, everybody seemed to think they might earn more than the neighbours and it would be annoying for those neighbours if they found out that they earned a little less-- although you could see that they had exactly the same lifestyle.
I thought this was the height of French parochial thinking, and this was just the sort of ideas one's parents would come up with.

Then several years later, a friend of mine who is an executive in an insurance company went on holiday to Israel with two of her colleagues. She decribed to me what they had seen, and in the end said "Well, we decided we would tell our other colleagues in the office that we had gone to Spain, so that people wouldn't talk".

So now (about 10 years ago), going to Israel was the sort of wealth that the middle class didn't want their neighbours to hear about.


In my school in San Diego, I was daily asked the weirdest questions, and it was impossible to guess what was coming next. They wanted high grades for non existing work, and they were curious-- nicely so, they had inquisitive minds.
I had resolved never to waver on the "no work, no results = no good grades" equation, and otherwise do my very best to compromise, as far as I could.

So naturally, one day they asked me how much I earned, one of those thousands of questions no French student would ever ask. I had a quick thought about my parents, and decided let's leave all that old thinking behind and make an effort : when in Rome...
So I did some approximate mental maths, and I told them.
In reward for my efforts, I got a chorus of "Is THAT all???"


Suddenly my parents' teachings were making a lot of sense. They had been meant to spare your neighbours the knowledge of your wealth, and
on the other side of the Atlantic breaking the silence earned you incredulity and pity for being paid so little!
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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 5:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Hi,

I am not ignoring you. I have to leave on a business trip.

Steve
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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 5:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
That's because every parent answers with "a million dollars" when asked that question. So don't feel bad Smile
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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 6:23 pm    Post subject: Loving the USA? Part 3. Reply with quote
Loving the USA? Part 3.


I made the most of my exchange years, both times I arrived two months before school started and left two months after the end of school.

I visited several states in the US, including Colorado and Hawai, but my two best memories are from Northern California. They were from two of my many trips-- the funny thing is I've forgotten which.

Both times I was incredibly lucky in being at the right place in the right time.

One was during a walk along a small body of water that connected with the sea further on.
There was a small whale that was obviously having a rest and playing on its own, in my memory about five meters from where I stood. I had never thought of whales as being little and playful. This was a gift.


During my second summer I visited colleagues from France who were staying in Northern California, near Mount Shasta.

One day they announced that they belonged to a group that was organizing a night walk, and as the moon was full, this was the day.

Everything was perfect. It started with an afternoon walk through a vast natural area-- it's a shame I can't remember what it was called.
Something that made you think of volcanoes or geysers.
At the end of the day we climbed up a mountain or hill, not something difficult. We had our picnic at the top watching the sunset, and we waited for darkness, lit by the moon, to go down.

The atmosphere was magic, I had never seen anything as beautiful or fascinating, no words could describe the exhilaration and the feeling of incredible luck that I had been able to share this experience with those friendly people. You could view the natural scenery of the afternoon for kilometres around.We had torches to see the path, but the moon was so
bright we did not need to look at our feet much.
We had three children with us and I had been asked to hold the youngest son, who was about 7, by the hand.
In the middle of the descent we met another party of American walkers and stopped to share the view and talk to them. We said we were from France, talking in low voices, and before going our separate ways a young woman from this group gave me a torch. I thanked her for her kindness and said I already had a torch. She insisted, and I understood that they wanted to share something with me, give me something, and I took it gratefully.

I have taken quite a few things back from the US, including two beautiful quilts that were hand made in Cape Cod, after a design I had chosen, and then shipped to my home.

However, the object that has the most emotional value is that torch.
I love the other objects for their beauty, and they're in the living room for all to see, but I know that the torch is there, in a small cupboard in my office. I'm not a photo person. I have good memories from many short holidays abroad I had, but the special magic memories are from a few fleeting unplanned moments in the countries where I had come for a long stay.
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PostPosted: Sat May 17, 2008 3:44 am    Post subject: French universities. Reply with quote
I'm going to write about universities in France.

Before I start I am happy to say that I am no longer the only French person at Booktalk.
Marie (dbooks) was born in France and is now a Swiss citizen, and Celinio lives near Paris (but would love to work in the States).
So Marie and Celinio, if you would like to comment or add something to my descriptions, feel free to do so.

I'll start with a comment from President Camacho and my answer to him in another forum:

Quote:
What I do know is that no one wants to go to a public French university. Tell me it isn't so Ophelia...


O: It's not quite that, but the basic problem that underlies that sentence does exist. We don't have private universities, so they are all state universities.
And before I agree with the underlying idea, I'll say that the basis is the very reverse: nearly everyone in France does want to go to university, and does go, regardless of intellectual ability and willingness to study.
But the clever French have a solution, so it's not as much of a problem as it might be somewhere else. I mean a solution that is still free and republican.
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