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Why Do So Many Have Trouble Believing In Evolution?

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Interbane

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Re: Why Do So Many Have Trouble Believing In Evolution?

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There is no data to support the hypothesis "nothing evolved into something"

"nothing" can not ever be data for a scientist to examine.
There is no data to support any detailed conclusion such as "nothing evolved into something". There is only data that supports a categorical conclusion, such as "whatever the explanation of the universe's origins, it is likely naturalistic".
Which of course makes a miracle like parting the red sea seem like a routine occurrence when compared to a truly miraculous event like nothing eventually turning into a something that has figured out NOTHING is the CAUSE for its something'ness!
Are we having a strawman festival, comparing assumptions to miracles? I think your dancing banana needs a troll partner!

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Flann 5
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Re: Why Do So Many Have Trouble Believing In Evolution?

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ant wrote:: Why Do So Many Have Trouble Believing In Evolution?


Quote:
This belief in nothing evolving into something is more likely to arise from erroneous psychological imagination.




Which of course makes a miracle like parting the red sea seem like a routine occurrence when compared to a truly miraculous event like nothing eventually turning into a something that has figured out NOTHING is the CAUSE for its something'ness!

:bananadance2:
And while so many (shockingly!) have trouble believing in evolution, it seems some have no trouble believing in the above proposition.
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ant

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Re: Why Do So Many Have Trouble Believing In Evolution?

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There is only data that supports a categorical conclusion, such as "whatever the explanation of the universe's origins, it is likely naturalistic"
actually, that's an extrapolation based on an assumption that has nothing empirical to tie itself to.


:bananen_smilies090:
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Flann 5
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Re: Why Do So Many Have Trouble Believing In Evolution?

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geo wrote:The idea that the eye and the relatively sudden diversification of life during the Cambrian era pose problems for evolutionary theory is simply not true. They are perceived as such—actively promoted as such—only in Creationist literature.
I think there is a tendency to just brush aside problems with the theory, on the grounds that the considerable majority of experts agree or the courts have ruled. Well they also agree that spontaneous abiogenesis occurred,whatever Pasteur might have discovered as scientific fact on this subject.
In fact Darwin himself thought the Cambrian fossils, or lack of intermediates, posed a serious problem for his theory,not to mention the eye, and I have discovered that recent scientific research has shown that there was plenty of oxygen in the pre-Cambrian era. So that can be ruled out as the catalyst for the sudden development and appearance of more complex forms of creatures in the Cambrian.
Last edited by Flann 5 on Tue Oct 21, 2014 4:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Why Do So Many Have Trouble Believing In Evolution?

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Michael Behe is certainly qualified to speak on the subject.

It's unfair to say or imply that part of the problem with trying to sort through all the information available to us is consulting someone like Behe.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Behe

To my knowledge, he is more qualified to speak about this issue more than anyone here.
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Re: Why Do So Many Have Trouble Believing In Evolution?

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Sure, Ant, but so what? Only about 1 in 700 scientists doesn't accept biological evolution. So you found one of the needles in the haystack. Congrats. :appl:
As reported by Newsweek: "By one count there are some 700 scientists with respectable academic credentials (out of a total of 480,000 U.S. earth and life scientists) who give credence to creation-science, the general theory that complex life forms did not evolve but appeared 'abruptly'."Martz & McDaniel 1987, p. 23
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Level_of_s ... _evolution

Why do you think you're more inclined to take the word of the 700 rather than the 479,300 who say the 700 are nuts? Seriously. Could this be a case of confirmation bias on your part? Or are the 479,300 credible scientists all committing the confirmation bias.
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geo

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Re: Why Do So Many Have Trouble Believing In Evolution?

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Flann 5 wrote:
geo wrote:The idea that the eye and the relatively sudden diversification of life during the Cambrian era pose problems for evolutionary theory is simply not true. They are perceived as such—actively promoted as such—only in Creationist literature.
I think there is a tendency to just brush aside problems with the theory, on the grounds that the considerable majority of experts agree or the courts have ruled. Well they also agree that spontaneous abiogenesis occurred,whatever Pasteur might have discovered as scientific fact on this subject.
In fact Darwin himself thought the Cambrian fossils, or lack of intermediates, posed a serious problem for his theory,not to mention the eye, and I have discovered that recent scientific research has shown that there was plenty of oxygen in the pre-Cambrian era. So that can be ruled out as the catalyst for the sudden development and appearance of more complex forms of creatures in the Cambrian.
Just because we don't know exactly how life first arose or how exactly the Cambrian explosion came about doesn't automatically mean that Goddidit. Sorry, God isn't the default answer. That may be what you believe, but that's not how science works. Science doesn't address the existence of God because there's no empirical evidence to test.

This is the fundamental flaw with Intelligent Design. It presents no scientifically testable hypothesis. It merely looks for gaps in our knowledge and assumes God is the answer.

It's also a Creationist canard that "Neo-Darwinism" is about to topple over under the weight of so many unanswered questions, In fact, we know a lot more about evolution than we ever have. As Interbane has said, evolution is well established by the evidence. Only in Creationist circles do you see this wishful thinking that it's going to go away.

We will probably never know with absolute certainty the answers to many of our questions. This is good news for god-of-the-gappers because they can always say Goddidit. But this is not a scientific response and never will be. This is a faith-based belief. It's intellectually dishonest to pretend otherwise.

There are quite a number of robust theories about the Cambrian explosion. Stephen Jay Gould first proposed the model of punctuated equilibrium suggesting that a lot of evolutionary change take place in relatively short periods of time tied to "speciation events."

http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evosite/e ... ated.shtml

We know that many species respond to stress by driving up their mutation rate. This is the fear with Ebola, that mutations will eventually turn the virus into an airborne vector. There is however no evidence that a human virus has ever changed its delivery method to airborne. (I read this in the Wall Street Journal).

Mutations are a complicated subject and science is always a work in progress. There's never a point where we just throw up our hands and say, well God must have did it! Scientists don't see a dead end as a failure. They see it as time to roll up their sleeves and get to work.

http://www.wired.com/2014/01/evolution- ... ssure/all/
-Geo
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Re: Why Do So Many Have Trouble Believing In Evolution?

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Geo wrote:Just because we don't know exactly how life first arose or how exactly the Cambrian explosion came about doesn't automatically mean that Goddidit. Sorry, God isn't the default answer. That may be what you believe, but that's not how science works. Science doesn't address the existence of God because there's no empirical evidence to test.
Well said. For a rational person to conclude that God is responsible for making "something mysterious happen" they'd at least have to first prove that God exists. The existence of mysterious stuff is not evidence for a God. It just means "wow, I don't know the answer to this YET."
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Re: Why Do So Many Have Trouble Believing In Evolution?

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Chris OConnor wrote:Sure, Ant, but so what? Only about 1 in 700 scientists doesn't accept biological evolution. So you found one of the needles in the haystack. Congrats. :appl:
As reported by Newsweek: "By one count there are some 700 scientists with respectable academic credentials (out of a total of 480,000 U.S. earth and life scientists) who give credence to creation-science, the general theory that complex life forms did not evolve but appeared 'abruptly'."Martz & McDaniel 1987, p. 23
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Level_of_s ... _evolution

Why do you think you're more inclined to take the word of the 700 rather than the 479,300 who say the 700 are nuts? Seriously. Could this be a case of confirmation bias on your part? Or are the 479,300 credible scientists all committing the confirmation bias.

Chris,

I said he was qualified to speak on the subject.
As in he possesses certain professional qualifications that establish expertise related to the field of science in question.

What else have I said besides that?
Last edited by ant on Tue Oct 21, 2014 7:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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ant

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Re: Why Do So Many Have Trouble Believing In Evolution?

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By the way,

In the name of science, you actually should be THANKING a scientist like Behe for contributing to the ongoing discussion of this field of science

Whether or not you disagree with Behe is irrelevant.
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