Ophelia's Journal.

Ophelia · Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 1:13 pm Post subject:

Penelope wrote:

Penelope · Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 2:08 pm Post subject:

As far as I know - there are a panel of judges - A Committee - when one applies for entrance to a public school. (There are fee-paying schools everywhere in England)

One of the questions which the panel considered was about whether the father had tattoos. Also if one applied for admission into a military school.

Some of these fee-paying schools - seem to be the schools for the incredibly dim....but rich........

The above seems to be the main motivating force here....the class/wealth..

Well - when we stopped being pushed about by 'religion' 'corrupt religion' that is, The people threw out the baby with the bathwater. We are an irreligious country. But I think that the people who have given up on religion are the ones who need 'true religion' most.

I will get back to you shortly....my Ophelia.....if you want me to....at the moment I must go and serve up dinner... Smile

I put a large shoulder of lamb in the oven and a rice pudding.....then we went for a walk along the canal - Trent and Mersey.... Smile

Ophelia · Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 4:58 pm Post subject:

Penelope · Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 6:26 pm Post subject:

They enrol the childrens' names for Eton as soon as they are born - they have the most chance of getting in if their father, or other members of their family went there......it is nothing to do with money...and not much to do with brains.....they are taught to be our leaders.

There is a college in Lancashire called Stoneyhurst - they go there to learn to be catholic priests.

Sandhurst is where they learn to be soldiers (well, officers). Prince Charles went there and I think Prince William.

I would not like to have to make that choice....some of my friends send their children to public schools around here....and although I don't really believe in private education........as things are at present in our schools, I don't blame those of my friends who choose to compromise.

The school I know of as famous in France is the Sorbonne.

Ophelia · Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2008 1:55 am Post subject:

The Sorbonne is a university, it's actually about 4 universities now, as in Université de Paris-Sorbonne IV.
I went to the Sorbonne in my third year at College. It was OK, I'm not sure if it was better than my local university in Tours; my colleagues here studied in Tours and were pleased with this.

The Sorbonne is famous because it was the first university to be created in the Middle Ages-- I guess, classes in Latin?
Also many prestigious writers taught at the Sorbonne.

The really prestigious schools in France are the "Grandes Ecoles", which are state schools; I'll need to return to this.

Ophelia · Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2008 2:29 pm Post subject:

In the 1990's, I realized I needed to know more about immigration in France.
Those were pre-internet days as far as I was concerned, and I got nowhere.
I was living in Saint Avold, a quiet little town, and my school had no problems. Then I moved to Tours, a middle-sized town, but again quiet, and a no-problem school. It never seemed urgent to get results on my enquiry, and the years went by.

Then came the three weeks of civil unrest in a number of poor suburbs ("banlieues") from October 27th, 2005 to November 17th.

First as I start writing there is still a controversy about what word to use for them .

President Chirac, on a trip to the US I think, made a point of saying in an answer to journalists' questions that this was not a riot, not to be compared with what had happened in Los Angeles in 1992 for example, and, in typical French spirit and with usual from-the-heart-political correctness, said these were " des évènements" (events).

So, évènements they were called on national TV channels when the country watched as the same pattern unfolded, night after night (nothing, or very litlle, ever happened during day time-- it was winter, so action started between 6 and 7 pm ) in different suburbs of the country.

"Riots" seemed too strong a term, and indeed no one was killed or seriously injured among either the protesters or the police-- there was, however, one tragic victim of the rioters' actions.*

" Events" was a ridiculous euphemism.
Now, the documents I read often refer to what happened as "émeutes" (riots). Wikepedia uses the terms "violences urbaines " and "civil unrest" in English.

For three weeks, the rioters burnt cars and sometimes public buildings, occasionally a few schools.

Although the burning cars made for spectacular photos and video pictures on the news, there was never any sense that this was a civil war and the country was about to be engulfed.
We seem to have developed a tradition of car burning in the last 20 years, so this was part of a pattern we knew about.

The patterns were familiar, but things had just become much worse, and the usual -- social, economic-- reasons were given.

On November 17th, Nicolas Sarkozy, then Minister of the Interior, announced that they had the situation under control.
The Minister himself had been responsible for some of the violence by calling the rioters "racaille" (rabble, rifraff).
It had been clear for a few years that "Sarko" had ambitions and would be a candidate for the succession of Jacques Chirac.
His supporters think he saved the day, and his detractors think he is responsible for everything.

As things were happening elements that stood out were:

- the work done by firemen, which prevented the fires from spreading, although they and their equipment were often attacked, as they too were seen as representatives of oppression.
- the professionalism of the police, which I think prevented escalation.
- the fact that the government resisted those who wanted to call in the Army, and insisted that this was a matter for the police; this was wise.

We hesitated between " How has it come to this?" and "I knew something like this would happen".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2005_civil_unrest_in_France

Ophelia

My second attempt at understanding (before and just after 2005) confirmed the findings of the first attempt.
This time I, like many other people in France, was connected to the web, and amazon had also had a branch in France for several years, which changed a great many things.

This is going to be at this stage mainly a chronicling of how this went nowhere, and why I think so little knowledge is available, and the many things I have learnt from the wall of silence.

I tried two basic ideas:

First I tried to read books on the subject, and my first unpleasant surprise was how very little seemed to have been published.

The few books that had been published by 2005 were at least 10 years old, and which is more, contained almost nothing that could help me.
I thought perhaps, because the subject was so sensitive, they thought they should write in such a boring way, and say nothing that had not already been said on the evening news.
After a few books, this was becoming, as well as fruitless, an expensive enquiry.

I was grumbling all along, because this also confirmed another fact of life: there is little pressure on French academics to publish. They're supposed to publish, but I wonder if it's not left up to them to do so or not.

In the past, whenever I had wanted to look up something, I looked it up at amazon.com and many academics in the States would have published something about it, it was just a matter for me to decide which book(s) I wanted to order.
When I vented my frustration by asking the people around me why French academics would not publish, I sometimes got the standard answer-- all good academics left many years ago and are now working in the States.
Not having enough funding for research is one of the facts of life in Europe-- the amount of money spent on research in countries like France or the UK is absurdly low, and the brain drain from Europe is not a myth.

I had the opportunity to see the results in California in 1991 because I knew a few people who were doing medical research: the professor was Italian, the researchers were from many different countries in the EU, and there was one person from India, and one from the States (also known as the "token American" in the group).

However, there is no reason to suspect that research grants would include studying current affairs in France.

Ophelia · Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2008 3:10 pm Post subject:

I decided to try some leading sociologists, although this hadn't been the field I was attracted to at first.

I tried to read what something by Pierre Bourdieu, a leading sociologist in France, with an interesting life -- lived a few years in Algeria and later wrote about people from Algeria living in France, but only about them.
(He died in 2002.)

This is the one book which hasn't annoyed me so far. I read about 50 pages, it consists in in extenso transcripts of thousands of hours of interviews of mostly low-income people who speak about their lives, about living in mixed neighbourhoods and what they have to say about neighbours of different races, their worries about the future, etc...
I leant from it, and I'm sure that if I could muster the energy to read all 1440 pages of it, in small print, there would be valuable insights, but I'm not quite prepared to do that. The main problem was that I as was reading about those pages and pages of everyday worries I was feeling more and more depressed.
The title of the book (since Les Misérables had already been taken by Victor Hugo) is: La misère du monde, not as in "Worlddwide deprivation", it's just France, but there is a saying about "toute la misère du monde".

Ophelia · Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2008 3:46 pm Post subject:

There was no chance of getting depressed with the last book I tried, a few months ago, but I went back to "annoyed", then "very annoyed" mode.
This was "Les féministes et le garçon arabe" (the feminists and the Arab boy), by academics Nacira Guenif-Soualamas and Eric Macé.

Here I had a promising title and a book cover with a catchy cartoon.

I was mostly annoyed by the style: long, impossibly intricate sentences, complicated vocabulary that seemed to be getting nowhere, the sort that is used by those particular professors I always tried to run away from.

It had only 90 pages, but I only made it to 10. In those 10 pages they introduced the idea that feminists were lesbians. I am open to new ideas, but it turned out that after 10 pages I still didn't know whether this was the thesis of the book, or somebody's idea that the authors were going to rebut.

At this stage it would have been a great satisfaction to hurl the book out of the window; on the plus side, it only cost 7 euros and amazon.fr does not charge to send you a book within France.

When I thought about it later, I think by reading this book I was taken straight into the middle of somebody else's quarrel-- there was a split within the Feminist movement in France a few years ago... well at this stage I'm not willing to find out.

All this is unfortunate for me: Nacira Guenif Souilamas is the daughter of immigrants, a sociologist and anthropologist who teaches at Paris XIII University, has written a thesis on immigration in France and has written many other books on this topic, so she should have been an ideal writer for this enquiry. Unfortunately the style she uses is typical of a certain kind of French intellectual, and I'm allergic to both the style and the writers. Razz

Still, I'll have to try something else by her before I give up.

Ophelia · Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2008 11:07 am Post subject:

My second idea for information about immigration was that, after all, I had been living in this country for more than 45 years, surely I could talk to a few people.
I found people like my colleagues from the English department, with whom I'd been discussing current events in the US or South Africa on and on for years, suddenly clammed up. I was told that these were issues you discussed -- if at all-- only with your family, or your bosom friends.

On one occasion somebody told me that she did't speak about immigration OUT OF CONVICTION. I understood this to mean that, for a socialist (as in supporter of the Socialist Party) this topic was too sensitive or too painful to be discussed, and that said convictions were generous ones, fighting for equality for example.

I understood that perhaps things were worse than I had thought. Not only was I going nowhere, but I could make enemies with this line of enquiry.

I do sometimes mention this topic to members of my family, but they know less than I do. At least they encourage me.

There is only one group of people that I'm sure would talk to me about immigration by the hour if I asked, but they're those you run away from once they've been identified: those harmless neighbours , affectionate dog owners (etc...) who support Jean Marie Le Pen's National Front Party, and have delighted us with their slogans over the years: Let's leave the EU,
"La France aux Français" (France for the French, meaning whites), "Les Français d'abord' (French people first).

Provisional conclusion: if you are interested in current affairs, make sure you keep to those of other nations. Sad

Penelope · Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2008 12:48 pm Post subject:

Ophelia said:-

I was told that these were issues you discussed -- if at all-- only with your family, or your bosom friends.

Ophelia - please continue to discuss. I am listening, and because we are in Europe together I am taking note.

My son, who has lived in Luton, Bedfordshire, in England is convinced that we are manipulated - he lived in Luton where there is a large immigrant population from all over the world. It is a real melting pot.

He liked to hear the muslim call to prayer when he was going to college in the morning.....he didn't mind it in the least. But there were people stiring up division.....

Divide and separate and weaken. We can get along with one another......we have been wondering if there is a move to separate us.

I am reading your journal and sharing it with those who are younger than myself. Please continue....but know that there is love....it is all we need, it is all that matters....it is all there is.....

I send you my great affection. P[/i]

Ophelia · Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2008 6:17 pm Post subject:

Hello Penelope, and thanks again. Smile

What you are suggesting is new to me.
I now have an idea where this enquiry is taking me, and it's nothing like this, I don't think that there is a plot or a conspiracy among the wealthy or the people in power.

What is unfolding is a sort of drama and saga where so many groups and individuals are contributing, not only the obvious people from the far right.

Today has been an excellent day for my quest.

I started by deciding I would be positive and go back to Ms Guenif-Souilamas. I printed an article she had written on the net, and found out that I could read and understand it.

At this precise moment my luck turned.

Ms G S brought almost nothing new, and neither did the next writer this led to.
This did not annoy me, as I wasn't expecting to find anything concrete or helpful at this stage. I realized once more I didn't even know what my questions were, so far I had been building a list of angles from writers from all political backgrounds which did NOT interest me.

Article number three was VERY interesting, and as aften with the internet all you need is one breakthrough, and this leads you to all sorts of other writings that are relevant. My printer has been working like mad, and by now I have entered the stage of "overwhelming information", which is a very nice change.

I followed each new lead, and at the end of the day this brought me back to my favourite site in French, "Riposte Laïque" , and finally to Education, another of the players in the game.

Very interesting article on Education, and then it was reward time: anybody who has followed me this far gets to share the reward.

This has brought me directly to what I had the feeling would be my conclusion at some stage in the future: stand up comics, who are both our saving grace in this often sorry tale and a means of becoming better people by laughing at our shortcomings, thus thinking about problems and bringing liberating laughter, instead of resorting to the old head-in-the-sand method.

Generally we don't respond well to preaching and moralizing injuction, and we have had so much of this in recent years-- I put moralizing speeches and writings among the players in the drama.

The documents are both excellent-- about Education, so only distantly related to my theme. The first one is only audio-- in French--, everything is spot on. Laughing

The second one is a video by Les Inconnus , who are very famous.
I had to watch it twice to make sure that everything was 100% bogus, and the pupils were acting as well. The setting is a real school , they don't all look like this but some do (my school is a treasure of historical architecture and renovation, but this is the exception, not the rule) . No wonder not much learning gets done... Anyway, the only thing I can't ascertain from the video is whether the classroom itself is genuine. It looks like they've built one on purpose for the sketch in the basement or the garage of the school-- I've never seen anything like this but who knows.

http://storage.canalblog.com/72/09/209246/9969306.swf

http://www.dailymotion.com/relevance/search/education%2Bnationale/vide o/x3q607_les-inconnus-education-nationale_fun

Penelope · Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2008 6:32 pm Post subject:

Thank you for those links Ophelia, I will look at them and pass them on.

I was not referring to a conspiracy from the Government or the wealthy, but I do mistrust the far right political groups. Not a conspiracy though, just a tendency to purposely and methodically stir up trouble and unrest. Wink

Ophelia · Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2008 10:27 am Post subject:

I think I didn't mention the link between the civil unrest in 2005 and 2007 and immigration.

Both times the fighting started after an incident with the police in Clichy sous Bois, a susburb outside Paris.

On October 27, 2005, Zyed Benna and Bouna Traoré, who were trying to escape from police check and questioning, hid in a power station, and were consequently electrocuted.
Relations with the police had been bad before and anger erupted.

There were never any political demands during the next three weeks: starting with the young people who lived in the same housing project (Cité HLM), the only explanation given was hatred for the police, who they said continuously behaved in a racist way by targeting non-whites in their identity checks for example.

On November 26, 2007, two teengers, S Mouchin and S Larami, driving a small motorbike ("mini moto") clashed with a police car on patrol in Villiers le Bel, also a suburb outside Paris. They died in the accident. The police in the car were not at fault (this was confirmed by eye witnesses).

Below you will find a link with 3 photos of a housing estate in Clichy.

A lot of the problems center on this type of buildings from the 1960's. They were built in haste, and cheaply, because the demand for housing was soaring. They were not meant to last over a few decades, and indeed a lot of efforts have been made locally, when those buildings have been torn down and replaced by neighbourhoods that are completely different and where people say they are pleased to live.

The majority of the buildings are still standing, and over the years this architecture has become the symbol of hopelessness.

I'm referring to the 2nd and 3rd photos below (the first one being City Hall!).
As far as I know they are not slums ; inside the flats are simple but decent -- as opposed to some slums that are left and either rented illegally or occupied without permission in some really old buildings in central Paris.

http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clichy-sous-Bois


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