new in booktalk - rosecoutre

rosecoutre · Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 3:13 pm Post subject: new in booktalk - rosecoutre

I saw this link at the member links at mensa.org and clicked without knowing it was a book/discussion/thinking website. Nice surprise. I have collected and given away thousands of books, endlessly cycling. I have an M.A. in literature and read novels, biographies, history, philosophy, creative-nonfiction, magazines, and newspapers (and editorial manuals since I'm an editor). I wrote a novel and a philosophy-of-language book on abstract objects. Those are my two main loves. My career is Web Editor for a lot of websites over the years (started as a regular print editor). I see that Chris O'Connor is in Clearwater, FL. I grew up in Clearwater -- lived there from 1962 to 1980.

Edited by: rosecoutre at: 8/25/05 5:19 pm

rosecoutre · Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 4:06 pm Post subject: Re: new in booktalk

I am replying to myself, message boards are so convenient for rambling. I have read most of Henry James' novels, stories, etc. I like most 1800s and 1900s British, French, and American novelists. I also read 1900s philosophy of language, like Wittgenstein, Tarski, Stalnaker, Kripke, Hintikka, etc. I haven't read a novel in a couple of years so I may need some direction and encouragement (and spare time!).

rosecoutre · Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 5:02 pm Post subject: Re: new in booktalk

Lately I have been spending a lot of time on CSS web design and jigsaw puzzles, but not enough reading or writing of my own (except rereading a few Sherlock Holmes stories). Writing freelance articles is a great way to keep up writing, which I used to do. Maybe it's time to start again!

Chris OConnor · Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 11:23 pm Post subject: Re: new in booktalk

Rose

Welcome to a fellow Mensan. ::04

I'm happy to see that my link actually worked. So here is a question for you. Are you an active Mensa member?

A few years ago (maybe 3?) I took the Mensa tests. I was hoping to become active in the organization and meet some interesting people. I'd recently gone through a divorce and was hoping to meet an intelligent woman and Mensa seemed like the right place.

Now that a few years have gone by I find that I've not attended a single event yet. Isn't that pitiful? But I kinda blame the organization. There just doesn't seem to be a means for brand new members to enter into the activities without feeling out of place. "Games Nights" might work, but these are held at individual members homes. I have yet to figure out a way to become active.

Actually, I do plan on attending the 2006 World Gathering for American Mensa. They've scheduled it for Florida fortunately. So are you an active member? Any suggestions for how I can get involved!?

And what is the title of your novel? I suggest you add a link so members can check it out. Is it sold on Amazon.com?

You've got me thinking I ought to read a Sherlock Holmes story or too. I've got a few on my shelf.

Oh, welcome to BookTalk Rose. Is Rose your name?

Chris

Edited by: Chris OConnor at: 8/25/05 12:26 am

Chris OConnor · Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 11:32 pm Post subject: Re: new in booktalk

And in case you haven't noticed we have an author as our guest tomorrow evening at 9:00 p.m. eastern. Dr. Victor Davis Hanson will be chatting with us about Jared Diamond's "Collapse," and "Guns, Germs And Steel: The Fates of Human Societies." Jared Diamond had originally agreed to a chat, but canceled on us. So we asked Dr. Hanson. Hanson wrote a rather impressive review of Collapse - rather harsh too. Join us at 9pm if you're interested! ::80

Chris

marti1900 · Posted: Thu Aug 25, 2005 7:14 am Post subject: Re: new in booktalk

HI and welcome. Nice to meet another fan of Henry James. What IS it about his work that is so engrossing? Maybe it's the great story lines combined with such lovely writing.

I look forward to more of your posts.

Marti in Mexico

rosecoutre · Posted: Thu Aug 25, 2005 9:51 am Post subject: Re: new in booktalk

Hi Chris, actually my name is rose-coutré. I am not active at mensa in person, but very "virtually" active -- like most of my socializing, I participate online by following links like yours, and on the "web heads" SIG, and other miscellaneous online areas. I would go to a weekday lunch in person if they had one near my Philadelphia suburb, but can't do evening/weekend activities in person.

I was divorced a few years ago too, and then married a smart math major who I had known in college. She's great, so ... now living happily ever after (favorite cliché)! I see the 2006 World Gathering is in Orlando. Maybe I'll try to go, or just follow the web coverage and blogs. I am looking for an excuse to revisit Florida though. Tempting. You asked about a link to my book -- the best link (without being a mile-long amazon link) is first go to my personal website at
www.geocities.com/lyttoncoutre/
-- then click on the image of the book (my pen name is Lytton Kavez).
Thanks for welcoming me to your Book Talk forums!

Edited by: rosecoutre at: 8/26/05 1:52 pm

rosecoutre · Posted: Thu Aug 25, 2005 9:59 am Post subject: Re: new in booktalk

Hi marti1900, Thanks for the welcome. Henry James is engrossing because you have to get engrossed to finish a single sentence! But then every sentence is well worth the trouble. His life is also interesting -- really enjoyed biographies of H.J. and his collected letters. I was so fascinated that I corresponded briefly with his great-grand-niece Bay James, who lived in Massachusetts (years ago). My favorite H.J. novel is "The Tragic Muse" -- but really liked all of them.

rosecoutre · Posted: Fri Aug 26, 2005 1:05 pm Post subject: Re: blogging in booktalk

This forum's instructions encourage using it as a personal journal or blogging space, so I'll take you up on it. I am trying out using this thread as a personal blog.

The most interesting novels to me have been those that explore the "life of the artist" in contrast against more conventional lifestyles. The most effective novel in this endeavor, I think, is Henry James' "Tragic Muse" -- another excellent one is Zola's "Masterpiece."

There are so many voices in society elevating non-intellectual and non-aesthetic lifestyles, I especially derive meaning and enjoyment from thoughtful, aesthetically advanced voices like Zola and Henry James. (One could debate forever on the meaning of "aesthecially advanced" -- not that anyone would necessarily get it "right" -- but anyway...)

The intellectual integrity in a work is extremely important, but often I think the aesthetic integrity is overlooked, e.g., how much sweat and blood went into crafting each sentence, word, and punctuation. (not making a point, just blogging thoughts)

Edited by: rosecoutre at: 9/14/05 10:30 am

rosecoutre · Posted: Tue Aug 30, 2005 4:19 pm Post subject: Re: blogging in booktalk

... more blog comments. As I commented on a "Rationally Speaking" column, I am especially interested in the possible-worlds-semantics argument for the reality of abstract objects. It entails a "true reality" that does "not actually exist" in the natural world. The true reality Stalnaker (see reference below) talks about is the abstract object entailed by a "possible world" -- and by extension any "abstract object" would obtain of that status of "real" though not "actual." But "real" vs. "actual" is only an epistemological distinction -- so an abstract object is *epistemologically* just as "real" as a natural object; but is not "actual" the way that a natural object is actual. (I think you may have to read Stalnaker for this to really make sense) This is not a metaphysical distinction -- i.e., Stalnaker was not saying abstract objects are *metaphysically* just as real as natural objects. I am interested in the implications of this distinction, especially pertaining to aesthetic objects and what constitutes a "work of art."

[REFERENCES:

Stalnaker, Robert C. “Possible Worlds”. Philosophy As It Is. Eds. Ted Honderich and Myles Burnyeat. London: Penguin, 1979: 447–465.

Pepper, Steven. “The Aesthetic Work of Art”. Art and Philosophy: Readings in Aesthetics. Ed. W. E. Kennick. New York: St. Martin’s Press, 1964: 108–125.]

Edited by: rosecoutre at: 9/14/05 10:31 am

rosecoutre

After some time off, I am writing another bloggy entry of thoughts.

Recent god-existence posts in the religion-and-philosophy forum got me thinking about that subject. The topic heading was "Why did God allow New Orleans to be destroyed?"

My brief studies in theology and religion made me aware of an interesting issue. Theologians emphasize the human concepts of 'good' and 'love' and project them onto God. According to both New and Old Testaments, God created some people for the very purpose of destroying them.

In Pauline letters, Paul notes God's *desire* to destroy people as a fact, and goes further and writes "who are you to question God?" -- emphasizing that God even *forces* people to turn away from him, for the very purpose of sending them to eternal suffering in Hell. In other letters, it is noted that even for God's chosen/elect/favorites, God will compel them to terrible suffering on earth. Is this a human concept of 'good' or 'loving'? Of course not. But that *is* the Christian God according to the information given in the Bible. I wonder why most theologians and believers ignore these attributes of God's nature, which are so prominent in both New and Old Testaments. I don't understand the aversion to accuracy (or is it just lack of effort?).

Regardless of whether you are an atheist, a christian, a theist, or other, I think it is important to be accurate. To accurately discuss the 'Christian God' from any of those frames-of-reference, it is important to have an accurate concept of the God being discussed, in this case, the Christian God. The New and Old Testaments are supposed to be the definitive source of information about the Christian God's nature. Christians and Atheists alike say both positive and negative things about 'Christian God' in ways that clearly show that they got their God-concept from sunday school, TV, or some source other than the primary source. (You have to acknowledge the Bible as the primary source of information on the Christian God's nature--by definition--that is where the Christian God is introduced, and is the final authority on such questions, if I am not mistaken.) If you want to find verification that the Christian God of the Bible exists, then you should be looking for people being destroyed or suffering.

To be accurate, the Bible also says there are cases where God comforts and helps people, but everyone already seems to know that part. I am only pointing out that if *all* people in all the world were happy with no suffering, THAT would be proof that the Christian God of the Bible does *NOT* exist. That would contradict the Bible's statements about God's nature. Having all people in all the world *free* of suffering/destruction, *or* having all people in all the world being destroyed or suffering, both "all" scenarios would be equally against the 'Christian God' -- and therefore might be viewed as evidence that there is no Christian God. As it is, there is no objective evidence whatsoever, anywhere in the world or in history, that God does exist or that God does not exist. There never will be any evidence either way.

You can believe if you want to, or believe for whatever reason/nonreason, or you can dismiss the whole issue of God's existence as irrelevant, or you can devote part of your life to agonizing over whether or not to believe in a God. In any event, in order to have a meaningful discussion, at least get familiar with the subject before you talk about it.

Edited by: rosecoutre at: 9/14/05 10:31 am


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