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My general notes on this book . . . 
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Post Section II - Part 2
Page 12

Don't you know the devilry of lingering starvation, its exasperating torment, its black thoughts, its sombre and brooding ferocity? Well, I do. It takes a man all his inborn strength to fight hunger properly. It's really easier to face bereavement, dishonour, and the perdition of one's soul -- than this kind of prolonged hunger. Sad, but true.

Guess it would depend on how much they were eating before they were faced with a lack of food.

If they were eating a lot, at one time - three meals a day, plus snacks, like we do in 'western' culture, then they'd be hungry.

If they were used to eating a half bowl of rice a day, they might not be actually aware of being undernourished.

It beats me how anybody can be hungry, living in that vast amount of forest and jungle - many things that grow wild are edible; surely the people knew what could be eaten.

They would have known the forest/jungle much better than their white visitors.

Just a thought . . .



Mon Feb 11, 2008 12:09 pm
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Post Sun still comes up in the east?
Goes down in the west - they'd know when it got dark, or when the sun rose in the morning - they'd know which bank it was.



Mon Feb 11, 2008 12:12 pm
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How great to contact you WildcityWoman!

I also have a lot of Budhist philosophy in me. We have a Budhist Meditation Group here in our little town. Sometimes I go and listen to the Budhist 'Nuns' give us a talk, then let us ask questions. Then they lead a meditation. You can watch people change over the weeks. I go when it is a 'Nun' and not a 'Monk'. Although I don't know why.

Somehow, since I have been practising....when I go to the supermarket, I don't just see a nice clean piece of chicken breast in a nice clean pack. I see the whole bird. And so it concerns me whether that bird has been treated like a cabbage instead of as a sentient being.

I smoke too. Is it OK smoke while I pray - I asked. No, she said, but it OK to pray while you smoke!!!

I drink coffee and alcohol - everything in moderation...Boring innit?

In the same way as the chicken in the polystyrene tray - strikes me as the whole bird. Then it occurs to me what I am working toward, at basics, and why. Hence - my abhorence at the suffering for such a useless thing as Ivory.

I think Budhism has made me more aware of life's principles. So although it is socially acceptable in this part of the world today to keep some animals in unspeakable cruelty - ie grow them like cabbages - I find that unacceptable. Budhism has disturbed my complacency - Hallelujah!



Mon Feb 11, 2008 1:19 pm
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Post 
Penelope wrote:
How great to contact you WildcityWoman!

I also have a lot of Budhist philosophy in me. We have a Budhist Meditation Group here in our little town. Sometimes I go and listen to the Budhist 'Nuns' give us a talk, then let us ask questions. Then they lead a meditation. You can watch people change over the weeks. I go when it is a 'Nun' and not a 'Monk'. Although I don't know why.

We have places you can go but I never get around to it. My daughter goes to a Vipassana retreat centre in a town north of here.

I'd like to go, but the first time you go, it can't be for just a weekend - you have to do a whole 10 days!

Geesh!

Here's the site where I listen to my dharma talks . . .

http://www.audiodharma.org/talks-gil.html

Yes, Penelope, it's good to meet you to - it's good to have somebody you can compare notes with.


Somehow, since I have been practising....when I go to the supermarket, I don't just see a nice clean piece of chicken breast in a nice clean pack. I see the whole bird. And so it concerns me whether that bird has been treated like a cabbage instead of as a sentient being.

Ha ha! I know - I did a chicken on Saturday - right now chicken is available at a decent price here in Toronto - it's probably 'in season', or maybe there's a glut of them right now, and they're chopping heads to keep the population down.

I smoke too. Is it OK smoke while I pray - I asked. No, she said, but it OK to pray while you smoke!!!

Yes - I've heard that story told by the dharma teachers many times - the way Gil Fronsdal (on the site I gave the link to) puts it is to say that a couple of monks went to the Abbot - one of them asked 'can I smoke while I'm meditating'. The Abbot said 'certainly not!'

The guy's buddy said 'hey! you put the question to him wrong - let me do it tomorrow.'

So they went in to see the Abbot and the guy said 'Is it ok to meditate while smoking.'

And the Abbot was pleased as punch - oh yes, he said - always meditate - no matter what you are doing.

I don't think the Buddha ever said anything about tobacco. He just said no intoxicating chemicals.


I drink coffee and alcohol - everything in moderation...Boring innit?

I don't drink alcohol - had a problem with it and had to quit. I haven't drank since Jan 1988 - I quit on Robbie Burns birthday.

In the same way as the chicken in the polystyrene tray - strikes me as the whole bird. Then it occurs to me what I am working toward, at basics, and why. Hence - my abhorence at the suffering for such a useless thing as Ivory.

Now, something like ivory - or wearing the fur of animals in a climate where you don't really need it - that, I don't like. When I was a young woman in my late teens and early twenties, I liked having a suede coat with a fur collar. I thought nothing of it.

Then when I was about 34 there was a group at a shopping mall who brought in a real live baby ocelot - they talked about their plight to save animals like that from being trapped or raised just for that purpose. I never wore fur after that. I even threw out the few rabbit skins we'd collected from one of trading posts when we went up north.

Coincidentally, right after I saw the ocelot demonstration, my boss got a new fur coat - she was an uppity bitch who flaunted her wealth in such a way that it was just plain vulgar - she came into the office with her new coat and it just happened it was 'ocelot'.

She asked how I liked it - I told her it would look better on the cat. She never wore it into work again.


I think Budhism has made me more aware of life's principles. So although it is socially acceptable in this part of the world today to keep some animals in unspeakable cruelty - ie grow them like cabbages - I find that unacceptable. Budhism has disturbed my complacency - Hallelujah!


Yes, I know what you mean.

[i]Buddhism has done a lot for me - I was studying Krishna for a while, then went looking around for meditation instruction - that's how I got interested in dharma talks.

I find that I think twice before I gossip, lie, and practice equanimity as much as I can.

My husband's a superintendent in the building where we live - a lot of nonsense comes our way at times, and I still blow my top occasionally.

But I don't stay mad long.

Well, it's nice that we're having this little chat.

I deleted the canoe mail addy.



Last edited by WildCityWoman on Tue Feb 12, 2008 2:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Mon Feb 11, 2008 2:38 pm
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Post BTW
My name's Carly . . . guess it doesn't show on these forums.



Mon Feb 11, 2008 2:39 pm
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Well thankyou for that Carley - I will email you too, then you'll get mine. I am too paranoid to put my email address on here. Some Buddhist me!! :sad:

You are called after one of my favourite singer/songwriters, Carley Simon, and now I am really showing my age!!!!

When we go to see our Buddhist Nuns, we pay on the night and it costs



Mon Feb 11, 2008 3:46 pm
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Post Better still . . .
I've deleted the wild city addy.

Well, I was going to listen to some more of this online audio, but I've been working since 10 am and I'm pooped out.

And we've had another blast of snow - poor Jeff's out there clearing the front lot once again.

We have snow removal contractors but they're here and there, on and off. You just never know what they're doing.

If you click into Wild City, on the link provided, you'll see the gardening forum - the pictures there will show you how big the lot is. A lotta' worki.

So I'll see you here later on today.



Last edited by WildCityWoman on Tue Feb 12, 2008 2:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Tue Feb 12, 2008 1:38 pm
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Post 
It is a sparkling frosty and beautiful day here. Very sunny.

I love the snow, but we don't get much here - when we do it doesn't lie for very long because of the salt (I think).

We have been promised another sparkley day tomorrow, then Thursday it is back to the gloom.

So then I will concentrate on answering Ophelia's HD questions.

Well after 3.00 pm when I finish work on Thursday.



Tue Feb 12, 2008 2:21 pm
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Post Sect II Part 2
I sheered her well inshore -- the water being deepest near the bank, as the sounding-pole informed me.

That's interesting - a sounding pole. I've never heard of that before.



Tue Feb 12, 2008 5:24 pm
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Post 
I was looking down at the sounding-pole, and feeling much annoyed to see at each try a little more of it stick out of that river, when I saw my poleman give up on the business suddenly, and stretch himself flat on the deck,

Oh, now I see how that would work.

. . the International Society for the Suppression of Savage Customs

Imagine that! I never knew there had been such a society! They should have one now - ha ha!



Tue Feb 12, 2008 6:05 pm
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Post Sect II Part 3
He began with the argument that we whites, from the point of development we had arrived at, "must necessarily appear to them [savages] in the nature of supernatural beings -- we approach them with the might of a deity," and so on, and so on. "By the simple exercise of our will we can exert a power for good practically unbounded," etc., etc.

Even knowing this book was first published in 1901, I found it hard to imagine that people thought this way.

Didn't they think it possible that we whites might have appeared odd to the so-called 'savages'?

Did our forebearers not abide anyone who was 'different'?



Tue Feb 12, 2008 6:12 pm
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Post 
My friends the wood-cutters were likewise scandalized, and with a better show of reason -- though I admit that the reason itself was quite inadmissible. Oh, quite! I had made up my mind that if my late helmsman was to be eaten, the fishes alone should have him. He had been a very second-rate helmsman while alive, but now he was dead he might have become a first-class temptation, and possibly cause some startling trouble.

Ha ha! That's why he decided to toss him overboard away from the riverside - he didn't want the natives to eat him!

And it turned out, al they had to do was blow the steam whistle.

Well, hard to believe, but I'm starting Section III - me, who thought she'd put this book away after a few pages.



Tue Feb 12, 2008 6:31 pm
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You know, I can't help thinking about this cannibalism thing . . . I wonder at what point in the development of mankind, we started to realize we shouldn't be eating each other.

If these natives thought nothing of eating human flesh, black or white, does it not stand to reason that at one time all men would eat the flesh of their fellows?



Tue Feb 12, 2008 7:08 pm
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Post 
Wildcitywoman wrote:

Quote:
You know, I can't help thinking about this cannibalism thing . . . I wonder at what point in the development of mankind, we started to realize we shouldn't be eating each other.

If these natives thought nothing of eating human flesh, black or white, does it not stand to reason that at one time all men would eat the flesh of their fellows?



I know very little about this, but at a guess I'd say that many human societies put a taboo on eating human flesh very early in their history, for practical reasons, just as there is a taboo on incest which was not put in place for the protection of little girls, but because the children of such unions were often deformed. I'm sure some anthropologists have wanted to find out why cannibalism developed in some human groups and not the majority of them.


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Wed Feb 13, 2008 2:44 am
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My husband - with his historian hat on...tells me that there were laws installed in the 18th century by the British Government regarding Cannibalism. It was an age of voyages and exploration and apparently they brought in laws to say it was OK to eat your fellow voyager if it was to preserve your life - but there were rules.

You will have to look them up on Google though...because he can't remember what the rules were about. :lol:



Wed Feb 13, 2008 2:33 pm
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