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"I know what the American People want."
More and more you see politicians and talking heads attributing whatever position they favor to the "American People" or "the common folks" or "the people". How convenient!
These are weasel words. Why is it that wikipedia demands better acountability than a cable news channel?
"Wherever i go, the american people demand to be able to taser children. We have to get this bill pushed through congress so that the people's will can be done. i promise, the instant this bill is through i will line up an entire junior soccor team and tase each one of them, one after the other, until they have ALL been tased! It's what the common folks want!"
Careful when you hear people lending credibility to themselves through nebulous ill-defined groups of "people" who seem to un-erringly back their every stance.
Chances are, you are hearing some bull.
_________________ Have you tried that? Looking for answers? Or have you been content to be terrified of a thing you know nothing about?
Nowhere in the Bible does it state that the truth would be revealed through logic and evidence. -James Williamson MD
Science flies you to the moon. Religion flies you into buildings.
In the absence of God, I found Man. -Guillermo Del Torro
If you think education is expensive, try ignorance. -Derek Bok
You wouldn't like me when i'm angry... Because I always back up my rage with facts and documented sources. -The Credible Hulk
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Re: "I know what the American People want."
They are speaking more truth than most cable news anchors, but unfortunately, they are a response to the nonsense on those channels, and so they don't show us the wider picture either.
They are necesary to try to curtail the stupidity of 24 hour news, but because they are small programs, and satirical, they do not have the resources or manpower, or even the stated purpose of bringing us the news that really matters.
That's what 24 hour news is supposed to do. And they fail us daily.
_________________ Have you tried that? Looking for answers? Or have you been content to be terrified of a thing you know nothing about?
Nowhere in the Bible does it state that the truth would be revealed through logic and evidence. -James Williamson MD
Science flies you to the moon. Religion flies you into buildings.
In the absence of God, I found Man. -Guillermo Del Torro
If you think education is expensive, try ignorance. -Derek Bok
You wouldn't like me when i'm angry... Because I always back up my rage with facts and documented sources. -The Credible Hulk
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Re: "I know what the American People want."
The American people are simply fed up with the bullcrap and bias of the mainstream news stations being slanted to that particular station's own ideology. People want honesty and they are not getting it.
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Re: "I know what the American People want."
I think a lot of people take the news anchors for their word. They don't question their resources or motives. Not only that, there are a good number of people that will believe something only because it fits their needs, or they are only out for themselves. People say my generation is the one of entitlement, but I think many Americans of all ages can be blamed for this. Whatever happened to working for what you want?
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The following user would like to thank vetwriter for this post: MitchReed
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Re: "I know what the American People want."
Can we all agree that both the liberal and conservative media present biased arguments? And it is up to each of us to sift through the trash to find the good stuff? Or are most of you indirectly saying that the party to which you do NOT belong is guilty of bending the truth while your own party is predominantly honest and truthful?
Let's get right to the point. Fox News is clearly conservative. I understand most liberals find Fox to not even be a news channel and they're evil and they kill puppies. All of this might be true. Let's assume this is true for the sake of moving on to the next step....
Name a liberal news channel that you feel presents a liberal argument dishonestly. Can you do it? Tell me how the liberal media has been dishonest and be specific. I can bash Fox News with the best of them, but can any of you openly speak out against the liberal media?
Consider that a challenge.
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Re: "I know what the American People want."
Are you serious Chris? You honestly don't believe that Keith Olbermann or Chris Matthews fall into the category of unfairly reporting pro-left beliefs? Hell, early on, poor Chris Matthews couldn't even speak of Obama without a thrill going up his leg!...his words, not mine. These guys make Sean Hannity promoting his conservative agenda on Fox, look like milquestoast?
Or let's take that famous news interview by one of the female reporters on CNN, harranging a protesting Tea Party Member holding his baby son, arguing that Obama's policies got him a tax cut so why was he against his policies?
Or let's talk about the Islamophobia argument that began being preached by many of the liberal mainstream media over the New York Mosque being planned at ground zero for instance...was that impartial reporting?
There is a clear double-standard in reporting within the industry, that's not an accusation, it is fact.
Yes, Fox News is slanted to the right, in as much as they are out of the mainstream of networks that lean for the left in any given argument...in huge numbers. It's rather interesting though, that most Americans today, trust Fox News to deliver the news...to give them more of the truth...and less of the 'spin' than other networks. Again, these are industry stats and facts...so why is that?
Believe me, you don't want to get me started on this subject, I can and will give you countless other examples, so you might want to end this before it goes viral. I tried to attach merely one video example so that you could review it to clearly see my point. Unfortunately, the site doesn't accept it. But it's an example of how the Mainstream Media played softball on vetting Obama during the 08 campaign. How they never aggressively brought up William Aryes or Jerimiah Wright...or Frank Marshall Davis...or anything else of substance that might have otherwise put Mr. Obama under the critical microscope. Maybe if they had, we might have another Clinton in the Whilte House, instead of this inexperienced, naive, unfocused twit of a President.
Personally, I believe there are far better topics to discuss than politics, as everyone seems so very partisan...and passionate at the same time, and I believe that's a recipe for disaster...don't you?
Let's discuss issues we can debate without raising the ire of everyone involved...I vote for civility.
Last edited by MitchReed on Thu Oct 14, 2010 12:51 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: "I know what the American People want."
Chris OConnor wrote:
Can we all agree that both the liberal and conservative media present biased arguments? And it is up to each of us to sift through the trash to find the good stuff? Or are most of you indirectly saying that the party to which you do NOT belong is guilty of bending the truth while your own party is predominantly honest and truthful?
Let's get right to the point. Fox News is clearly conservative. I understand most liberals find Fox to not even be a news channel and they're evil and they kill puppies. All of this might be true. Let's assume this is true for the sake of moving on to the next step....
Name a liberal news channel that you feel presents a liberal argument dishonestly. Can you do it? Tell me how the liberal media has been dishonest and be specific. I can bash Fox News with the best of them, but can any of you openly speak out against the liberal media?
Consider that a challenge.
I think both parties are to blame. I'm not saying any one side is right or completely honest. But you do have to admit that when one party is in control, the opposing party will bash them with all they have. They did it to Bush, and they're doing it to Obama. We are part of a democratic country, so why do we have 2 parties that basically rule? I think having 2 main parties creates too much hate, when if anything, we need to be unified.
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Re: "I know what the American People want."
Chris OConnor wrote:
Name a liberal news channel that you feel presents a liberal argument dishonestly. Can you do it? Tell me how the liberal media has been dishonest and be specific. I can bash Fox News with the best of them, but can any of you openly speak out against the liberal media?
Liberals, and you who are called liberals
(with respect to L Cohen)
To answer your question from the start I'll say No, with an explanation. I consider it a trick question since I don't believe there to be any such thing as a liberal media. It is more reflective of reality to argue for the media being roughly grouped into the camps of the right and the far right than it is to claim that the liberal media boogeyman does actually exist.
I'll condense your question to this: Name a liberal news channel.
No, I can't.
EDIT: Democracy Now (Amy Goodman) pretty much fits the bill though I doubt the show can be labled as itself being a channel. Anyway, without having listened to it in over a year my recollection of it is that while presenting news with a decided bias to the left it does employ an honest presentation of the various issues of the day. So no, I can't "speak out" against it.
EDIT2: And I disagree that the 2-party systems breeds hate; people are born with the quality. What I consider the system to breed is apathy.
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Re: "I know what the American People want."
MitchReed wrote:
Are you serious Chris? You honestly don't believe that Keith Olbermann or Chris Matthews fall into the category of unfairly reporting pro-left beliefs?
I never even referred to either of these people in my post. I wasn't arguing that the liberal media is more honest than the conservative media. Quite the opposite. My entire point was that both sides are so damn biased that they tune out the nonsense coming from their own camp and focus on the nonsense coming from the "enemy." This is called the "confirmation bias."
I made a challenge to the liberal members of BookTalk.org (90% of our members are liberal) to point out some specific examples of how the liberal media twists and turns things dishonestly. I don't think anyone can or will step forward and bash their own party. (I do all the time)
YOU can do it because you're a conservative. This doesn't impress me as much as when a liberal can be honest enough to point out flaws in the liberal agenda.
But since we can see you're a conservative I offer you the same challenge. I'd like to hear you critique Fox News honestly.
Quote:
Believe me, you don't want to get me started on this subject...
Yes we do. That's what BookTalk.org is all about. Give us your best arguments. Nothing is sacred or off-limits here.
Quote:
so you might want to end this before it goes viral.
A BookTalk.org discussion going viral would be a good thing.
Quote:
I tried to attach merely one video example so that you could review it to clearly see my point. Unfortunately, the site doesn't accept it. But it's an example of how the Mainstream Media played softball on vetting Obama during the 08 campaign.
Just give us a link to the video on YouTube. See the "youtube" button above?
Quote:
How they never aggressively brought up William Aryes or Jerimiah Wright...or Frank Marshall Davis...or anything else of substance that might have otherwise put Mr. Obama under the critical microscope. Maybe if they had, we might have another Clinton in the Whilte House, instead of this inexperienced, naive, unfocused twit of a President.
I want to hear a liberal make these comments.
Quote:
Personally, I believe there are far better topics to discuss than politics, as everyone seems so very partisan...and passionate at the same time, and I believe that's a recipe for disaster...don't you?
This is the politics forum and we discuss politics here. Yes, things get heated but we all can handle it. Not discussing these subjects doesn't solve anything.
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Re: "I know what the American People want."
Agree with open discussion points completely Chris.
We can, have, and will discuss all kinds of topics which touch on sensitive issues, and we do so fairly often here.
I am a liberal in the sense i don't believe in making laws to regulate who you are allowed to have sex with, but i think in a lot of respects i would be called a conservative. Especially in economics.
I ridicule CNN daily for their lack of actual news coverage. I have deep abiding scorn for their coverage of events. Just think about the hoopla over the Chilean miners who were recently set free, or the absolute garbage which was the coverage of Anna Nicole Smith's death. A completely non-news event.
CNN suffers from turning news into entertainment, and i would never argue otherwise. I don't post about them very often here, because i see their problem as being competence related, and that doesn't bother me quite as much because they never seem to be making a point. Plus it has been months since i watched CNN. Disgusted by the Anna Nicole Smith thing.
Fox "News" suffers from being a direct mouth piece of the republican party. They are un-abashed. They don't even really attempt to hide their political leanings, but that isn't so bad in itself. What i have a problem with is the "News" part of their title. I post about them all the time.
The main problem i see there is that they have bought into the "Politics as a team sport" concept whole heartedly. It doesn't matter the positions they post, the people they back, or the stances. All these things can change within hours over there. What matters is getting your guy into office and defending him from all attacks, regardless of merit.
I don't rail against liberal news reporting the way i do Fox because i haven’t seen anything on those channels that even approaches the blatant pandering witnessed on Fox "News". It is outstanding that this channel is treated with such respect. If it were relegated to the respect it deserved, something along the lines of the prestigious reporting done in the Enquirer, for instance, i would have no problem. But instead, it is taken seriously and they ask to be treated as a news leader with a straight face.
I would be very interested if you could locate examples which compare to what i have posted in that thread, actually.
_________________ Have you tried that? Looking for answers? Or have you been content to be terrified of a thing you know nothing about?
Nowhere in the Bible does it state that the truth would be revealed through logic and evidence. -James Williamson MD
Science flies you to the moon. Religion flies you into buildings.
In the absence of God, I found Man. -Guillermo Del Torro
If you think education is expensive, try ignorance. -Derek Bok
You wouldn't like me when i'm angry... Because I always back up my rage with facts and documented sources. -The Credible Hulk
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Re: "I know what the American People want."
I have kind of given up on cable news. Not much better at the networks. I watch Brian Williams for a good fifteen minutes on the NBC Nightly news and never saw any news.
I never watch MSNBC. I have heard that they are the liberal equivalent of Fox.
_________________ Have you tried that? Looking for answers? Or have you been content to be terrified of a thing you know nothing about?
Nowhere in the Bible does it state that the truth would be revealed through logic and evidence. -James Williamson MD
Science flies you to the moon. Religion flies you into buildings.
In the absence of God, I found Man. -Guillermo Del Torro
If you think education is expensive, try ignorance. -Derek Bok
You wouldn't like me when i'm angry... Because I always back up my rage with facts and documented sources. -The Credible Hulk
Joined: Sep 2010 Posts: 74
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Re: "I know what the American People want."
Kevin wrote:
Chris OConnor wrote:
Name a liberal news channel that you feel presents a liberal argument dishonestly. Can you do it? Tell me how the liberal media has been dishonest and be specific. I can bash Fox News with the best of them, but can any of you openly speak out against the liberal media?
Liberals, and you who are called liberals
(with respect to L Cohen)
To answer your question from the start I'll say No, with an explanation. I consider it a trick question since I don't believe there to be any such thing as a liberal media. It is more reflective of reality to argue for the media being roughly grouped into the camps of the right and the far right than it is to claim that the liberal media boogeyman does actually exist.
I'll condense your question to this: Name a liberal news channel.
No, I can't.
EDIT: Democracy Now (Amy Goodman) pretty much fits the bill though I doubt the show can be labled as itself being a channel. Anyway, without having listened to it in over a year my recollection of it is that while presenting news with a decided bias to the left it does employ an honest presentation of the various issues of the day. So no, I can't "speak out" against it.
EDIT2: And I disagree that the 2-party systems breeds hate; people are born with the quality. What I consider the system to breed is apathy.
Liberal news channel: I would have to say MSNBC is more "liberal" than the other news channels.
The 2-party system doesn't necessarily "breed" hate, but it definitely causes people to make it seem like if you don't belong to one or the other, then you are in the wrong. I don't completely associate with either party, because their "values" change. Also, depending on where you are from, the definition of what is liberal and conservative changes. If you are down south, liberal might be closer to what is considered conservative in a big northern city.
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