Online reading group and book discussion forum
  HOME ENTER FORUMS OUR BOOKS LINKS DONATE ADVERTISE CONTACT  
View unanswered posts | View active topics It is currently Sat Aug 27, 2016 3:27 pm

<< Week of August 27, 2016 >>
Saturday Sunday Monday Tuesday Wednesday Thursday Friday
27 Day Month

28 Day Month

29 Day Month

30 Day Month

31 Day Month

1 Day Month

2 Day Month





Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 3 posts ] • Topic evaluate: Evaluations: 0, 0.00 on the average.Evaluations: 0, 0.00 on the average.Evaluations: 0, 0.00 on the average.Evaluations: 0, 0.00 on the average.Evaluations: 0, 0.00 on the average. 
From A(rendt) to Z(imbardo) 
Author Message
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
The Pope of Literature


Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 2553
Location: decentralized
Thanks: 0
Thanked: 0 time in 0 post
Gender: None specified

Post From A(rendt) to Z(imbardo)
It occurs to me that our two selections for the end of 2007 closely resemble two sides of the same coin. Both deal with morality, social responsibility, and the existence of evil, but one does so from a political and historical perspective while the other does so from a cognitive and experimental perspective. Arendt, for example, has written about the Milgram experiments in relation to Nazism and the formation of an internally militant German society. What I'd like to see is a few people reading both books and playing them off of one another, but even if you have either little time or inclination to read both, I hope that the people reading just the Zimbardo book will keep tabs on the Arendt discussion and comment where they see fit. Talking about the two books in tandem ought to bring out facets of the complexity of modern morality that we wouldn't have encountered reading either book on its lonesome.


_________________
If this rule were always observed; if no man allowed any pursuit whatsoever to interfere with the tranquility of his domestic affections, Greece had not been enslaved, Caesar would have spared his country, America would have been discovered more gradually, and the empires of Mexico and Peru had not been destroyed. -- Mary Shelley, "Frankenstein; or The Modern Prometheus"


Tue Nov 06, 2007 11:43 pm
Profile


Post Arendt Vs Zimbardo Vs Schiller
I joined this web site for the sole sake of participating in this particular discussion. I read Zimbardo's work and I read Arendt's first work about Eichmann. Arendt's initial work was based upon a lot of personal interpretations of court documents regarding Eichmann. In his book "Becoming Eichmann", author David Cesserani proves that Arendt wasn't present during enough of Eichmann's trial to generate an authentic account of the events or of Eichmann's state of mind.

Zimbardo's work is fascinating from a psychological point of view. I have personally worked in the mental health care field for 10 years and find most of his theories relative to the themes. However, the Milgram and Stanford Prison Experiments were controlled environments. Zimbardo should be lauded for this work but it remains theory and guesswork at best in its attempts to explain why good people turn to bad behavior.

On the other hand there is one book, "Directive 19" that was written by a former Nazi officer who remained unapologetic and firmly convinced that his actions were justifiable despite having served 30 years in prison for war crimes. This man was a lawyer; had a decent and religious upbringing and was a moral and ethical man. He personally killed over 150,000 people. In his book he explains how such circumstances become "necessary" and how he altered his mindset to carry out these heinous plans. Rolf Schiller tells us how and why these things happened from the perspective of a man who actually did them. In my opinion, even though one may find Schiller reprehensible, his claims carry fact while Arendt and Zimbardo study and assess these matters from an outside view.



Mon Nov 12, 2007 11:02 pm
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
Float like a butterfly, post like a bee!


Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 57
Thanks: 0
Thanked: 0 time in 0 post
Gender: None specified

Post 
Arendt says:

Quote:
There is a widespread conviction that it is impossible to withstand temptation of any kind, that none of us could be trusted or even be expected to be trustworthy when the chips are down, that to be tempted and to be forced are almost the same,...."


I don't know where Arendt encountered this conviction, but I have never encountered it anywhere and find it hard to believe that any such conviction is widespread. Surely there is a difference between saying that sufficient pressure (which Arendt calls "temptation"--a word overloaded with religious connotations of carnal desire) is capable of causing human beings to do things they are ashamed of, and equating that to a conviction that no one can withstand any pressure/temptation at all.



Tue Nov 13, 2007 2:47 pm
Profile
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 3 posts ] • Topic evaluate: Evaluations: 0, 0.00 on the average.Evaluations: 0, 0.00 on the average.Evaluations: 0, 0.00 on the average.Evaluations: 0, 0.00 on the average.Evaluations: 0, 0.00 on the average. 



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:



Site Links 
Forum Rules & Tips
Frequently Asked Questions
BBCode Explained
Info for Authors & Publishers
Author Interview Transcripts
Be a Book Discussion Leader!
IDEAS FOR WHAT TO READ:
Bestsellers
Book Awards
• Book Reviews
• Online Books
• Team Picks
Newspaper Book Sections

WHERE TO BUY BOOKS:
• Great resource pages are coming!

BEHIND THE BOOKS:
• Great resource pages are coming!

Featured Books

Books by New Authors


*

FACTS is a select group of active BookTalk.org members passionate about promoting Freethought, Atheism, Critical Thinking and Science.

Apply to join FACTS
See who else is in FACTS







BookTalk.org is a free book discussion group or online reading group or book club. We read and talk about both fiction and non-fiction books as a group. We host live author chats where booktalk members can interact with and interview authors. We give away free books to our members in book giveaway contests. Our booktalks are open to everybody who enjoys talking about books. Our book forums include book reviews, author interviews and book resources for readers and book lovers. Discussing books is our passion. We're a literature forum, or reading forum. Register a free book club account today! Suggest nonfiction and fiction books. Authors and publishers are welcome to advertise their books or ask for an author chat or author interview.



Copyright © BookTalk.org 2002-2016. All rights reserved.
Display Pagerank