Online reading group and book discussion forum
  HOME FORUMS BLOGS BOOKS LINKS DONATE ADVERTISE CONTACT  
View unanswered posts | View active topics It is currently Wed May 23, 2012 3:24 am




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 8 posts ] 
Curious Incident: Pages 178 - 221 
Author Message
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
BookTalk.org Hall of Fame

BookTalk.org Owner
Diamond Contributor 3

Joined: May 2002
Posts: 12133
Images: 0
Location: Florida
Highscores: 145
Thanks: 856
Thanked: 378 times in 300 posts
Gender: Male
Country: United States (us)

Post Curious Incident: Pages 178 - 221
The Curious Incident of the Dog in the Night-Time (Pages 178 - 221) ::44

Edited by: Chris OConnor  at: 1/26/06 10:10 pm



Thu Jan 26, 2006 10:08 pm
Profile Email YIM WWW
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
The Pope of Literature


Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 2557
Location: decentralized
Thanks: 0
Thanked: 0 time in 0 post
Gender: None specified

Post Re: Curious Incident: Pages 178 - 221
I'm gonna skip the next-to-last section for the moment -- mostly because I don't have my copy with me, so I'm not sure about what events that section covers.

If you've finished the book, what do you think of the conclusion? Christopher seems to have gotten just about everything that he wanted, including a grandiose dose of confidence that leads him to believe that he can achieve whatever he wants to in life.

But what struck me as the book went on is how I sort of fell through the cracks of the story Christopher was trying to tell and ended up with a fair measure of concern for his parents. Their lives don't seem particularly better for the changes that have taken place. It's difficult getting around the conclusion that Christopher is so divorced from the interior lives of the people around him that he can't help but be destructively selfish.

I felt a particular measure of pity for the father. Granted, he did some very ignoble things in the novel, but his sense of irreconcilable remorse really resonated with me. He's a guy who will likely be striving for the rest of his life to win forgiveness from a boy who likely doesn't understand what it's like to feel the crushing weight of responsibility he feels.

Given a larger portion of the book, the mother probably would have won an equal share of my sympathy. She's a deeply flawed woman, and it must be incredibly smothering to be know that you're so ill-suited to the card that fate has played you. Her explanation to Christopher in the earlier chapters was the start of my sympathy for her. She seemed to genuinely feel that she's so poorly suited to be his mother that he and his father will be better off without her dragging them down. Then again, it may be hard to reconcile that professed reason with her affair. If she had left on her own, it would be carte blanche understandable -- that she left with another man leaves open some doubt as to whether or not those reasons were foremost in her mind.

But the impression I was left with at the end of the novel is that these people, though still estranged, make up a kind of island. No one else can really see into the feelings of love and personal responsibility that tie Christopher's parents to him. And for that reason, they're more isolated at the close of the story than they probably ever were before.




Sat Feb 11, 2006 6:03 pm
Profile
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
Asleep in Reading Chair


Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 175
Thanks: 0
Thanked: 0 time in 0 post
Gender: None specified

Post Re: Curious Incident: Pages 178 - 221
It seems to me (I read the book about a year ago, so I may misremember) that, since the book is Christopher's PoV, he is isolated from the consequences of actions, and from the emotions of others. This leads to a portrayal of the parents as both also seeming distant from others. I envisage it like a dark stage, with each one picked out by a separate spotlight.

But this is what we infer from Christopher's narration, and we might also infer that the situation is very different, but he is unaware of the subtlety of tone and gesture which complete communication. Indeed, we might regard some of Christopher's actions as self-fulfilling.

If we were to be having a chat with the author, I think a prime question would be why the mother is so lightly sketched. We sense Christopher's bond to her, but she doesn't seem to come alive from the page the way others, even minor characters do.

_________________________________________________________

Il Sotto Seme La Neva




Fri Feb 17, 2006 8:47 pm
Profile
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
Genuinely Genius

Silver Contributor

Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 806
Location: NC
Thanks: 0
Thanked: 0 time in 0 post
Gender: Female
Country: United States (us)

Post Re: Curious Incident: Pages 178 - 221
I am glad that I read MA's post here before making my post. I was going to say pretty much the same thing. I just finished the book and am still feeling sad for the parents. I feel very sad for the parents, especially the father. The scene on p 194 where the mother asks, "Christopher, let me hold your hand. Just for once..." really pulled at my heart strings. Christopher does not allow the hand holding. I am a very tactile person. I could easily imagine how much the mother was torn between her needs for this physical comfort and the needs of her child to not be touched. Then, on p 197, when Christopher can't/won't even hold his hand up to his father in their gesture of love and the father cries, I felt even sadder for him! What a difficult life for all members of this family.




Sat Feb 25, 2006 3:13 pm
Profile
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
Freshman

Bronze Contributor 2

Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 212
Location: San Francisco, CA
Thanks: 0
Thanked: 1 time in 1 post
Gender: Male

Post Re: Curious Incident: Pages 178 - 221
Quote:
and ended up with a fair measure of concern for his parents. Their lives don't seem particularly better for the changes that have taken place.


Well, no. They don't seem better off. But, would you really expect them to? Do you think that having this happen would make them better people? They are who they are, and things like this are not going to make them forget their failed relationship, etc. The incident does make them deal with the consequences of their actions in a more realistic way, but they are still going to have their flaws. It seems to me that you are sort of looking for a fairy tale ending where they reconcile or get back together for the 'sake of the children'?




Sat Mar 04, 2006 2:30 am
Profile YIM
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
Freshman

Bronze Contributor 2

Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 212
Location: San Francisco, CA
Thanks: 0
Thanked: 1 time in 1 post
Gender: Male

Post Re: Curious Incident: Pages 178 - 221
Quote:
I could easily imagine how much the mother was torn between her needs for this physical comfort and the needs of her child to not be touched. Then, on p 197, when Christopher can't/won't even hold his hand up to his father in their gesture of love and the father cries, I felt even sadder for him! What a difficult life for all members of this family.


ugh, tara, you have totally hit this on the head. I almost cried. As a new parent, I just couldn't imagine having to relate to my child this way.




Sat Mar 04, 2006 2:33 am
Profile YIM
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
Genuinely Genius

Silver Contributor

Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 806
Location: NC
Thanks: 0
Thanked: 0 time in 0 post
Gender: Female
Country: United States (us)

Post Re: Curious Incident: Pages 178 - 221
Gino- Since you felt the same way I did about that scene, I thought I'd share what happened to me on Friday. An autistic child who is in a self-contained classroom at my school comes to my regular ed classroom as a reward for work completed/good days. I have maintained that he requests my room becuase there is something about the room decor and orderliness that appeals to him, as he mostly walks around my room looking at the things hanging on my walls. Since, I am familiar with autistic children, I am always careful with my interactions with him. On Friday, he came to visit with his teacher and did his typical walking with some screaming of what sounds like my last name. His teacher always tells him to, "Say goodbye Anthony" and he always gazes in my direction and says, "Goodbye Anthony". On Friday, he walked over to me, got about an inch from my face and mimed a hug and kiss! I was so touched. His teacher was ecstatic. I had to tell her not to get too excited as he didn't actually touch me. Still, he came so close! That made my day.




Sun Mar 05, 2006 7:13 pm
Profile
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
The Pope of Literature


Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 2557
Location: decentralized
Thanks: 0
Thanked: 0 time in 0 post
Gender: None specified

Post Re: Curious Incident: Pages 178 - 221
ginof: It seems to me that you are sort of looking for a fairy tale ending where they reconcile or get back together for the 'sake of the children'?

Geez. No, I'm not looking for a fairy tale ending, and my comment wasn't a criticism of the book. I'm just pointing to the fact that Christopher is able to turn off the negative consequences of the events -- he seems to think that there has been some sort of fairy tale ending, where he has both his parents back and gets to be an astronaut. And I think it's impressing that Haddon played so heavily against the type here. Any happier ending would have robbed his characters of the flaws that make them really engaging as humans.

It also occurs to me that this sort of ending might be somewhat common to stories about people with autism. I'm thinking specifically about "Rainman" here, though I wonder if perhaps there aren't other stories about autism that also play on the disparity between how we perceive consequences and how the autistic characters perveive the consequences.




Tue Mar 07, 2006 3:42 pm
Profile
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 8 posts ] 



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:

Recent Posts 
My forum name and avatar is that of my Dad's book.

Wed May 23, 2012 1:36 am

Chris OConnor

Prominent Scientists and their religiosity

Wed May 23, 2012 12:44 am

Chris OConnor

Climate Apocalypse

Tue May 22, 2012 5:46 pm

Robert Tulip

Brian Greene on the multiverse

Tue May 22, 2012 4:38 pm

Dexter

Emotobooks?

Tue May 22, 2012 2:35 pm

Toobi

succesful ways to promote

Tue May 22, 2012 12:33 am

Ban me now

Ch. 9 - The uniqueness of human being

Mon May 21, 2012 9:50 pm

Dexter

Totally Gratuitous Self-Promotion: Doulos

Mon May 21, 2012 9:35 pm

Doulos

Government Institutions

Mon May 21, 2012 8:20 pm

Dexter

Why, Hello there!

Mon May 21, 2012 7:02 pm

Kevin


Celebrating 10 Years Online!

BookTalk.org Links 
Forum Rules & Tips
Frequently Asked Questions
BBCode Explained
Info for Authors & Publishers
Featured Book Suggestions
Author Interview Transcripts
Be a Book Discussion Leader!
    

Love to talk about books but don't have time for our book discussion forums? For casual book talk join us on Facebook.

Support BookTalk.org 
BookTalk.org is being upgraded to a totally new design. This upgrade is expensive. Any support would be VERY helpful! See who supports us.
Make a donation

PEOPLE PAYING FOR OUR UPGRADE:

• afv - $10 May
• LevV - $50 March
• Dexter - $10 March
• supernova38 - $25 March
• Oblivion - $20 March
• jheimlich - $20 February
• Robert Tulip - $50 February
• giselle - $50 January


Featured Books

Recent Blogging 

WORMING TABLETS AND WESTFIELD

24th March

Children here need worming regularly, and  I think I need to buy more worming tablets, so while my friends sit on the beach, I have to catch bush taxis up to the… more

Posted: 16 days ago
by heledd

TUESDAY 20TH MARCH

The children have a long way to walk to the nearest primary school. At the moment they are in temporary accommodation, with volunteer teachers. There is community land available, a… more

Posted: 18 days ago
by heledd

The 12th Disciple $3.99 (USD) on Kindle...

The price of The 12th Disciple has been updated to $3.99 for Kindle readers. The book is still available for free to borrow for Amazon Prime members.  To be competitive, and s… more

Posted: 21 days ago
by 12th disciple

The 12th Disciple reviews...

The 12th Disciple has been reviewed by two different people on Amazon. They purchased the Kindle edition; one in the US, one in the UK. One review was 5-stars (US) and the oth… more

Posted: 30 days ago
by 12th disciple

The Stages ‘In’ and ‘Out’ of Life

From the book; The Joys of Live Alchemy

Every human being experiences distinct stages in their lives. First, birth... Second, learning to walk and talkÂ…Third, learning the rule… more

Posted: 38 days ago
by michaellevys

Hello world!

Welcome to BookTalk.org Blogs. This is your first post. Edit or delete it, then start blogging!

See those links at the very top of the page? To get into your control panel for… more

Posted: 38 days ago
by michaellevys

Cutting Truths - Book Review

This review is from: Cutting Truths: Fifty Enlightening Slices of Life (Paperback) 178 pages ... 5.0 out of 5 stars     Sleeper Cells Awaken,

By Julie Clayton… more

Posted: 38 days ago
by michaellevys

Nonviolence Quotes

From Gandhi:

“Anger is the enemy of nonviolence and pride is the monster that swallows it up.”

“An eye for an eye will make the whole world blind.”

“I have nothing ne… more

Posted: 43 days ago
by jamessanderson

Harry Potter Enthusiast

I'd like to say I've been reading Harry Potter since the day the world renown series appeared on the scene.  Unfortunately, the truth is I began reading Harry Potter… more

Posted: 45 days ago
by kinse1na

Good Friday, Better Saturday, Blessed Sunday

Easter teaches many of us the importance of redemption and resurrection. Regardless of what faith people follow, the story of Jesus Christ has been told in many languages in many c… more

Posted: 45 days ago
by 12th disciple

Let The Blogging Begin!

Our Book Talk will begin on Wednesday, May 2nd. I look forward to hearing about your learning and classroom experiences with Number Talks as it all unfolds...

Posted: 50 days ago
by msbeth

MONDAY 12TH MARCH. COMMONWEALTH DAY

Today is Commonwealth Day. All the children come in their various ethnic clothes and bring food traditional to their groups.

We have Fula, Mandinka, Manjargo, Wollof , Jola… more

Posted: 51 days ago
by heledd

CHRISTIAN NONVIOLENCE

NONOPPOSITIONAL NONVIOLENCE “The minute you conquer the fear of death, at that moment you are free. I submit to you that if a man hasnÂ’t discovered something that he will die f… more

Posted: 52 days ago
by jamessanderson

FEBRUARY 26TH, SUNDAY

Yesterday, when I went to feed Jeni the donkey, I noticed swarms of bees entering EbrimaÂ’s house through the cracks in the door. We both had a look, but he didnÂ’t open his door… more

Posted: 53 days ago
by heledd

Exciting News...Now You Can Order Blessings of the Father - Book One on sale at only $4.98 on B&N.com!

Hello fellow followers of the written word:

I'm pleased to tell you that there is finally a downloadable epub version for Book One of my saga; Blessings of the Father … more

Posted: 78 days ago
by mitchreed

What Number Talks Is All About

Whether you want to implement number talks but are unsure of how to begin or have experience but want more guidance in crafting purposeful problems, this dynamic multimedia resourc… more

Posted: 78 days ago
by msbeth

Feeling Entitled Is Not Always A Bad Thing

Do you feel entitled? For years I have listened to and, in some instances, complained that some people in America feel entitled. For years I have watched as these people are portra… more

Posted: 79 days ago
by life is a business

Free Kindle promotion very successful for The 12th Disciple

On Fat Tuesday and Ash Wednesday of 2012, The 12th Disciple was free to Kindle users on both days. In all, about 550 worldwide Kindle users downloaded a copy of the book.

The 12… more

Posted: 80 days ago
by 12th disciple

Sacred Are the Brave

‘Sacred Are the BraveÂ’ a collection of short stories about the nonviolent revolutions 1986-1989 is now available in Kindle. Each of the nine stories has characters who are just … more

Posted: 83 days ago
by jamessanderson

The Weekend Trippers

The Weekend TrippersÂ’ is the true story of Rfn Ted Taylor and his part in the heroic last stand in Calais May 1940. The Weekend Trippers is based on TedÂ’s diaries written at the… more

Posted: 85 days ago
by carolemct






BookTalk.org Chat Room 
Enter the BookTalk.org Chat Room

Enter our Chat [0]

Chat Room Always Open!

Tell your friends when to meet you
in the BookTalk.org Chat Room.

If you enjoy business bestsellers and would like to expand your business knowledge check out the quality book summaries offered by the world's leading book summary company.






BookTalk.org is a free book discussion group or online reading group or book club. We read and talk about both fiction and non-fiction books as a group. We host live author chats where booktalk members can interact with and interview authors. We give away free books to our members in book giveaway contests. Our booktalks are open to everybody who enjoys talking about books. Our book forums include book reviews, author interviews and book resources for readers and book lovers. Discussing books is our passion. We're a literature forum, or reading forum. Register a free book club account today! Suggest nonfiction and fiction books. Authors and publishers are welcome to advertise their books or ask for an author chat or author interview.


Navigation 
MAIN NAVIGATION

HOMEFORUMSBOOKSTRANSCRIPTSOLD FORUMSADVERTISELINKSBLOGSFAQDONATETERMS OF USEPRIVACY POLICY

BOOK FORUMS FOR ALL BOOKS WE HAVE DISCUSSED
Moby Dick: or, the Whale by Herman MelvilleA Visit from the Goon Squad by Jennifer EganLost Memory of Skin: A Novel by Russell BanksThe Structure of Scientific Revolutions by Thomas S. KuhnHobbes: Leviathan by Thomas HobbesThe House of the Spirits - by Isabel AllendeArguably: Essays by Christopher HitchensThe Falls: A Novel (P.S.) by Joyce Carol OatesChrist in Egypt by D.M. MurdockThe Glass Bead Game: A Novel by Hermann HesseA Devil's Chaplain by Richard DawkinsThe Hero with a Thousand Faces by Joseph CampbellThe Brothers Karamazov by Fyodor DostoyevskyThe Adventures of Huckleberry Finn by Mark TwainThe Moral Landscape by Sam HarrisThe Decameron by Giovanni BoccaccioThe Road by Cormac McCarthyThe Grand Design by Stephen HawkingThe Evolution of God by Robert WrightThe Tin Drum by Gunter GrassGood Omens by Neil GaimanPredictably Irrational by Dan ArielyThe Wind-Up Bird Chronicle: A Novel by Haruki MurakamiALONE: Orphaned on the Ocean by Richard Logan & Tere Duperrault FassbenderDon Quixote by Miguel De CervantesMusicophilia by Oliver SacksDiary of a Madman and Other Stories by Nikolai GogolThe Passion of the Western Mind by Richard TarnasThe Left Hand of Darkness by Ursula K. Le GuinThe Genius of the Beast by Howard BloomAlice's Adventures in Wonderland by Lewis Carroll Empire of Illusion by Chris HedgesThe Sound and the Fury by William Faulkner The Extended Phenotype by Richard DawkinsSmoke and Mirrors by Neil GaimanThe Selfish Gene by Richard DawkinsWhen Good Thinking Goes Bad by Todd C. RinioloHouse of Leaves by Mark Z. DanielewskiAmerican Gods: A Novel by Neil GaimanPrimates and Philosophers by Frans de WaalThe Enormous Room by E.E. CummingsThe Picture of Dorian Gray by Oscar WildeGod Is Not Great: How Religion Poisons Everything by Christopher HitchensThe Name of the Rose by Umberto Eco Dreams From My Father by Barack Obama Paradise Lost by John Milton Bad Money by Kevin PhillipsThe Secret Garden by Frances Hodgson BurnettGodless: How an Evangelical Preacher Became One of America's Leading Atheists by Dan BarkerThe Things They Carried by Tim O'BrienThe Limits of Power by Andrew BacevichLolita by Vladimir NabokovOrlando by Virginia Woolf On Being Certain by Robert A. Burton50 reasons people give for believing in a god by Guy P. HarrisonWalden: Or, Life in the Woods by Henry David ThoreauExile and the Kingdom by Albert CamusOur Inner Ape by Frans de WaalYour Inner Fish by Neil ShubinNo Country for Old Men by Cormac McCarthyThe Age of American Unreason by Susan JacobyTen Theories of Human Nature by Leslie Stevenson & David HabermanHeart of Darkness by Joseph ConradThe Stuff of Thought by Stephen PinkerA Thousand Splendid Suns by Khaled HosseiniThe Lucifer Effect by Philip ZimbardoResponsibility and Judgment by Hannah ArendtInterventions by Noam ChomskyGodless in America by George A. RickerReligious Expression and the American Constitution by Franklyn S. HaimanDeep Economy by Phil McKibbenThe God Delusion by Richard DawkinsThe Third Chimpanzee by Jared DiamondThe Woman in the Dunes by Abe KoboEvolution vs. Creationism by Eugenie C. ScottThe Omnivore's Dilemma by Michael PollanI, Claudius by Robert GravesBreaking The Spell by Daniel C. DennettA Peace to End All Peace by David FromkinThe Time Traveler's Wife by Audrey NiffeneggerThe End of Faith by Sam HarrisEnder's Game by Orson Scott CardThe Curious Incident of the Dog in the Night-Time by Mark HaddonValue and Virtue in a Godless Universe by Erik J. WielenbergThe March by E. L DoctorowThe Ethical Brain by Michael GazzanigaFreethinkers: A History of American Secularism by Susan JacobyCollapse: How Societies Choose to Fail or Succeed by Jared DiamondThe Battle for God by Karen ArmstrongThe Future of Life by Edward O. WilsonWhat is Good? by A. C. GraylingCivilization and Its Enemies by Lee HarrisPale Blue Dot by Carl SaganHow We Believe: Science, Skepticism, and the Search for God by Michael ShermerLooking for Spinoza by Antonio DamasioLies and the Lying Liars Who Tell Them by Al FrankenThe Red Queen by Matt RidleyThe Blank Slate by Stephen PinkerUnweaving the Rainbow by Richard DawkinsAtheism: A Reader edited by S.T. JoshiGlobal Brain by Howard BloomThe Lucifer Principle by Howard BloomGuns, Germs and Steel by Jared DiamondThe Demon-Haunted World by Carl SaganBury My Heart at Wounded Knee by Dee BrownFuture Shock by Alvin Toffler

OTHER PAGES WORTH EXPLORING
Banned Book ListOur Amazon.com SalesMassimo Pigliucci Rationally SpeakingOnline Reading GroupTop 10 Atheism BooksFACTS Book Selections

cron
Copyright © BookTalk.org 2002-2011. All rights reserved.
Website developed by MidnightCoder.ca
Display Pagerank